Full Frontal (Counterweight 3 perk) - Advies with a snare?

[Klod9002]

Melee classes usually have CC tools in normal games

Of course they do, however they have melee range for their CC and they lack such snare/root resistance like advs/enfs/shades can get.

[rakhabit]

Of course they do, however they have melee range for their CC and they lack such snare/root resistance like advs/enfs/shades can get.

Have you played WoW recently?

[Gatester]

Have you played WoW recently?

I get to laugh at this before Klod makes a comment hehe. Better would be to compare it to every melee prof in games through the history of gaming. They either have CC tools, or they have dash/leap attacks, or both.

Melee is supposed to hit you. However CC profs should somewhat control melee. CC tools should honestly be fixed before we keep adding these tools to melee profs and adjusting RS.

[Kinkst44h]

Have you played WoW recently?

I honestly havent played WoW recently, but I sure do remember charge, hamstring, interecept, blessing of freedom, repentence, etc etc etc for melee classes.

As well as crippling poison, that druid root amongst others (and I am damn sure they added more since BC)

Not only that, see Warhammer where tanks have snares that reduce you to walk speed (all of them, and they're all perma effectively), Stuns, Knockbacks and general manhandling tools.

AO melee classes do also "sort" of fit the mould with stuns, incapacitates, etc if they get into melee range to begin with.

Point being - It's not a stretch for melee classes to get some love when it comes to getting in range, and staying in range.

[Kinkst44h]

....so they need to run and can't root the Advie in any case.

Fancy melee classes getting a tool (for SIX PERK POINTS) to MAYBE keep someone in range if they are going to run (and thus, almost always never die from a melee class)

[sultryvoltron]

I get to laugh at this before Klod makes a comment hehe. Better would be to compare it to every melee prof in games through the history of gaming. They either have CC tools, or they have dash/leap attacks, or both.

Melee is supposed to hit you. However CC profs should somewhat control melee. CC tools should honestly be fixed before we keep adding these tools to melee profs and adjusting RS.

This is my only thought on the matter. As long as melee professions can be immune to CC, and as long as CC is totally screwed up like it is, this perk root is retarded. When they fix up the real problems (100% immunity to CC, 23 minute snares, 8 minute roots, etc) then they can add these cool tools to melee if they need them, although my guess is they won't especially after a RS nerf.

[rakhabit]

OK, you can't be serious with WoW. Look at AoC, but you don't wanna go with PvP rules like there, trust me. AO is not WoW, nor AoC.

It's just my opinion of course, but WoW pvp is much more engaging than AO pvp, there's a lot more room for player skill to be the determining factor. Take pets for example: On my Hunter, my pet can charge to interrupt a spell cast, block melee hits against me, remove roots from me, root my target, make me immune to crits, or attack my target; a good hunter knows when and how to use all these abilities. The pet alone has more abilities to use in combat than my Engineer in AO does. On my engineer, my pet can attack, that's all, its snare doesn't even work well enough to keep targets in range. I think everyone who plays a pet class in AO would love to have the plethora of tools that WoW pet users have.

Now back on the topic of Melee having a root
Roots in general need to have their durations drastically shortened in pvp, no form of crowd control should be more than a few seconds. Under such a system, it's okay for melee to have roots because 1) if the melee uses it at the wrong time they probably just lost themselves an opportunity to score a kill and 2) the target of the root won't just be stuck there for an inordinate amount of time. Pvp is a lot more fun when you actually have to use your CC wisely and not just unload an alpha once your target is below the threshold of how much your alpha will damage him.

I'm not saying I want AO pvp to be just like WoW, I'm saying I want AO pvp to be as engaging as WoW pvp. Right now it's not even close, most classes only use a very small part of their toolsets in pvp. I think FC is taking a big step in the right direction by slowing down DPS and making all the neat perks that have been in the game for years actually useful and possible to land.

[Klod9002]

I sure hope they never, ever take anything from WoW. Thank you very much.

[Hacre]

Fancy melee classes getting a tool (for SIX PERK POINTS) to MAYBE keep someone in range if they are going to run (and thus, almost always never die from a melee class)

I don't see why an Advie, a non cc class should be able to root or snare me suddenly when since SL they have happily lol'd at cc as well as enjoyed more runspeed than 95% of cc classes

[Kinkst44h]

I don't see why an Advie, a non cc class should be able to root or snare me suddenly when since SL they have happily lol'd at cc as well as enjoyed more runspeed than 95% of cc classes

Because they are (sometimes?) melee, and should have the right to engage you in combat if they waste 6 perks for it.

In reality - This should simply be given to these classes free, not for 6 points.

[Gatester]

I don't see why an Advie, a non cc class should be able to root or snare me suddenly when since SL they have happily lol'd at cc as well as enjoyed more runspeed than 95% of cc classes

Honestly Adventurer is a poor example of so much whining about this. There really are not any spare perks to spend on counterweight for adventurers unless you give up AR, which you need to land the perks, or defense, which would mean survival goes way down.

Any adventurer using these roots/snares on you will be a weaker opponent.

[Klod9002]

Because they are (sometimes?) melee, and should have the right to engage you in combat if they waste 6 perks for it.

Melee adv still runs faster then 95% of other profs, is practically immune to snare/roots, has brawl, root grafts, so err...

NO!

P.S.
CCL about 6 perk points root. This thread is about 3 perk points -1k snare.