I made my trader for tradeskills.
Trade skills aka divest/plunder/wrangle
Cudus:
You say you are at 25% effectiveness after drains and would be at 0% if one more drain landed on you. Could you elaborate, Lohem?A trader can drain you max 415 points.
CHS SMG req: 556
Your SMG skill after divest/plunder advanced: 385
You will be 50% if your smg skill is 800. If it is 805 you will be 75% effective.
Ok so im talking out of lvl 200 experience.
What i dont get is this complaint about u getting OE from our drains. CHS gets OE yes that does not mean Nova Flow does. U have to think a little before u pull out the nerf stick.
So 1 proff can make u go OE with ur CHS and u call for nerf? When at same time u wont go OE with another weapon?
Is this because u have a disadvantage with the MOST powerful weapon u got? U gotta make some priorities, when fighting a trader dont use ur CHS use a nova flow.
Ok so Lohem go fight a doc, let him start by init debuffing u then move onto casting that evil dot wich lowers ur skills with 100 points or so. Then he heals up any dmg u got. Oh i forgot he stacks another DoT on u after that.
Nerf?
Then we move onto a MP. Since he got a heal pet he wont be to worried about waiting for his nano shutdown to recharge. Then he stuns u and surely wont be to worried about recharge on that either. All this while his Demon eats on u. Oh then he lands a couple of nukes on you.
Nerf?
Then we have enforcer. His layers and mongo will help him protect himself against alpha strikes. His mongo will also keep him healed while he is using rage to run away from u while MK is up. Then he will bash ur butt to the ground when ur MK drops.
Nerf?
Then we move onto the Adventurer. This guy will heal all ur damage while his DMG shield eats on u. His X-3 rifle will also do pretty descent damage while ur MK is up and when it drops u will die or u have to run to a zone.
Nerf?
Then we also got Fixer. His HoT's will heal up any dmg u do to him (if u hit him - see Grid Armor). If u try to run he will root you. If u actually does dmg to him (someone without Grid Armor) his HoTs will still heal it up. But lets say for some reason u get very lucky and bash in alot of dmg in short time(dont see that happening), the fixer will grid out and he will be back to woop ur ass in no time.
Nerf?
We also have the Engineer. Engineer will keep ur deflect shield pretty debuffed so him and his little friend mr Slayer-Droid will be able to bash u down easy. They dont have much but its sure effective when used right way.
Nerf?
We also have the Bureaucrat. He will keep u rooted (and ur friends) while ur MK is up and then stand far away and let his pet chew on u. If he is brave he will step closer and unleash one of the best nukes in game on u + shoot a little.
Nerf?
Then we have the Nano-technician. He will keep u rooted while ur MK is up and his layers/Nullity will eat ur dmg while he nukes/shoots u. Oh and add a debuff and stun to that also.
Nerf?
Then we have the MA. He will heal up most ur dmg during MK is up. Then he will change dmg type to remove effects from ur deflect bracer. Then he will either DoT u for around 300-500 points or use a heal for 2500, all this while he woops ur ass with UVC running.
Nerf?
And the last proffession that will woop ur ass, Agent. This class have multiple options. He can just keep u rooted and use his crit buffs at a well selected point (See MK drop). But can also turn into any class he wants (with -140 in nano skills) and use that against u so see above on my other examples.
Nerf?
To me it looks like u should ask for a boost of ur proffession instead of crying for nerfs.
Enforcers, Engies, some soldiers, Doctors, Adventurers, Agents, MPs are the ones i see have a chance at killing a Trader. Im not bad at pvp. I know what i am talking about because ive been out there for a long long time and ive had to change my tactics every now and then so i dont have to run for zone.
Im very tired of theese "ive just been killed lets go cry for nerf on boards" threads. So please Lohem stop with it. Only times ive even seen u in pvp is on rare ocations in Camelot castle and even then u hardly get to fight.
::Edit::
Do i have to add that Traders drained mostly get resisted at higher levels? Raise nano resist and dont fight on full aggro. Do not come with that "how fast will a 2.5/2.5 weap be if im not on full aggro?" USE ANOTHER WEAPON THEN!!!!!
Last edited by Coc^-^; Sep 6th, 2002 at 04:47:04.
weeeeee
Traders are the ones on trial in this thread, so no need to start bringing every other class in the game into the thread.
ok.. cocio so in order to combat traders we must run missions for lower quality weapons that wont go into OE when u deprive us.. and keep them in our inventory..
we are also expected to make a new shortcut bar of nano's we can use after we are sucked back in time 80 levels.. hmm ok..
and we have to use some really crappy weapons because we have to fight full defense to resist your deprives? (which i must add do not get resisted as much as you would love to think)
dear lord.. i just wont duel traders for the work that involves...
-lvl 200 soldier here btw.
Here is a not so crappy weapon u can use without being OE.
Nova Flow
There u go.
Sidenote: Yes it does get resisted alot. I know, im the one casting.
weeeeee
Originally posted by Coc^-^
Ok so im talking out of lvl 200 experience.
What i dont get is this complaint about u getting OE from our drains. CHS gets OE yes that does not mean Nova Flow does. U have to think a little before u pull out the nerf stick.
So 1 proff can make u go OE with ur CHS and u call for nerf? When at same time u wont go OE with another weapon?
Is this because u have a disadvantage with the MOST powerful weapon u got? U gotta make some priorities, when fighting a trader dont use ur CHS use a nova flow.
hmm ok so we cant use our best weapons against you.. no biggie eh? we will take our CHS off and go through hhell to get it back on just because you said so.
Ok so Lohem go fight a doc, let him start by init debuffing u then move onto casting that evil dot wich lowers ur skills with 100 points or so. Then he heals up any dmg u got. Oh i forgot he stacks another DoT on u after that.
Nerf?
docs may need a nerf.. well healing my need a nerf. docs are super powerful but look what? a trader can whup any docs ass because he cant use any of his damned nano's anymore
Then we move onto a MP. Since he got a heal pet he wont be to worried about waiting for his nano shutdown to recharge. Then he stuns u and surely wont be to worried about recharge on that either. All this while his Demon eats on u. Oh then he lands a couple of nukes on you.
Nerf?
an mp can debuff a soldier in a similar way as a trader.. not allowing you to use your nanos.. but they have crap for HP and no roots.. and and P.S. that demon hits like a pansy.. MP will be dead and the thing will still be scratching at you.. heal pet has been nerfed. MP can be great but not like a trader (i have a 150 mp)
Then we have enforcer. His layers and mongo will help him protect himself against alpha strikes. His mongo will also keep him healed while he is using rage to run away from u while MK is up. Then he will bash ur butt to the ground when ur MK drops.
Nerf?
I would say enforcer is a realyl well balanced class with nothing people would consider so powerful that it is imbalancing.. maybe a few small issues but an enfrocer can kick your arese.. they are also possible to beat. why nerf possible the most well rounded class in the game?
Then we move onto the Adventurer. This guy will heal all ur damage while his DMG shield eats on u. His X-3 rifle will also do pretty descent damage while ur MK is up and when it drops u will die or u have to run to a zone.
Nerf?
hmm there are like 3 advents that pvp.. and havent fought any recently.. but they can heal so thier ok.. again this comes down to the heals being 100% they got some love and are respectable now.. still nothing that is so powerful people of all classes cry nerf.
Then we also got Fixer. His HoT's will heal up any dmg u do to him (if u hit him - see Grid Armor). If u try to run he will root you. If u actually does dmg to him (someone without Grid Armor) his HoTs will still heal it up. But lets say for some reason u get very lucky and bash in alot of dmg in short time(dont see that happening), the fixer will grid out and he will be back to woop ur ass in no time.
Nerf?
Fixers are uber now.. I still am not sure where i stand because self buffed i think i could take down even a GA 4 fixer with some luck, great class now.. well balanced. G4 may need a looking at.. but guess who whups there asses? traders...
We also have the Engineer. Engineer will keep ur deflect shield pretty debuffed so him and his little friend mr Slayer-Droid will be able to bash u down easy. They dont have much but its sure effective when used right way.
Nerf?
hah this is rediculous there are like 2 engies that pvp and they are the most terrible pvp class. drain them and thier bot becomes useless their gun overequipped.. they have little HP so even a soldier could kill one while that "badass" slayer picks away at you
We also have the Bureaucrat. He will keep u rooted (and ur friends) while ur MK is up and then stand far away and let his pet chew on u. If he is brave he will step closer and unleash one of the best nukes in game on u + shoot a little.
Nerf?
a very high lvl crat can own with rule of one.. and a pet. and roots. but there arent too many crats that pvp.. I beleive a crat could be the best pvp class if played right.. again trader can deprive bot into OE.. root them just as well.. and take away thie dmg (and ability to nuke) again trader owns this class.
Then we have the Nano-technician. He will keep u rooted while ur MK is up and his layers/Nullity will eat ur dmg while he nukes/shoots u. Oh and add a debuff and stun to that also.
Nerf?
nano tech can be very powerful in the open.. it comes down to tactics. a NT out in the open will own a soldier.. but not a trader. they need to fumble for nukes they havent used in 50 lvls. in the arena a NT would get owned by a soldier imo..
Then we have the MA. He will heal up most ur dmg during MK is up. Then he will change dmg type to remove effects from ur deflect bracer. Then he will either DoT u for around 300-500 points or use a heal for 2500, all this while he woops ur ass with UVC running.
Nerf?
MA's are great.. they are well rounded like the enforcer.. and like the enforcer have a chance to beat a trader because they have some tools.. and FC has given them some love. MA's can mostly beat me but I don;t care they are extremelyy well balanced.. and heck they may even be able to kill a trader.
And the last proffession that will woop ur ass, Agent. This class have multiple options. He can just keep u rooted and use his crit buffs at a well selected point (See MK drop). But can also turn into any class he wants (with -140 in nano skills) and use that against u so see above on my other examples.
Nerf?
your just describing the class and asking nerf? none of the above traits you mentioned for any class are so overpowering as the deprives.. traders can and do own every class most of the time.. no other class can say that. why have people complained about traders for so long.. all the time. i guess were all just goofs who are clueless and dont know how to pvp.
To me it looks like u should ask for a boost of ur proffession instead of crying for nerfs.
i agree here.. we could use boosts but its not gonna happen. we ask for boosts and FC doesnt listen. people ask for nerfs and it happens dont blame us blame FC.
[/B]
Enforcers, Engies, some soldiers, Doctors, Adventurers, Agents, MPs are the ones i see have a chance at killing a Trader. Im not bad at pvp. I know what i am talking about because ive been out there for a long long time and ive had to change my tactics every now and then so i dont have to run for zone.
Im very tired of theese "ive just been killed lets go cry for nerf on boards" threads. So please Lohem stop with it. Only times ive even seen u in pvp is on rare ocations in Camelot castle and even then u hardly get to fight.
::Edit::
Do i have to add that Traders drained mostly get resisted at higher levels? Raise nano resist and dont fight on full aggro. Do not come with that "how fast will a 2.5/2.5 weap be if im not on full aggro?" USE ANOTHER WEAPON THEN!!!!! [/B]
hmm nova flow yeah i can not be OE with that.. at lvl 200, barely. what about the rest of AO that isnt? i cant use my alpha guns cause i get stuck with them on.. cant use IEC or aimed shot weapon. or mk unless i cast it off the bat and risk root and run.
gah heh why am i argueing if i dont play anymore.
Its all about making sacrifices. If u cant use ur best weapon against us then use something else. Man dont even come with that argument that just hilarious. Its the "hey i wanna be uber and i have to use the best shiz to kick ur ass" argument.
From the looks of it Rk1 people either suck in pvp or they have no idea what they are doing.
Maybe ur engies should talk to Ethernal on rk2. Kinda hard for a trader to beat a engie that resists every nano that gets casted against him aint it?
Enforcer (talking about the ones using the weapon that wont drop anymore) can kick anyones ass just like a Trader can. No one really cares do they?
Our trait is to debuff ur skills. Like every other proffession we got something. U and like every other proffessions wants our trait nerfed. Have u checked on how many people that actually play a trader? We second last after crat i belive.
A few of us stick out from the masses cuz we learned how to actually pvp. Not like u can just start a trader > debuff him > expect to win. If u belive it is like that then i feel sorry for you.
Ive been reading alot of posts made in this forum and mostly its from rk1 players whining about something. From the looks of it no one of u except a few know how to use their proffession (wenzell, angelicnova, Fotic, Gunnandahalf, Auno to name a few). Ive also spent alot of time watching pvp fights in 2ho with my lowbie (disregarding the standard flames for 1: dual loggin 2: Spy) its actually kinda fun watching u guys fight. 1st tactic is to run for zone, zone in and out until u get bored. Second is Alpha THEN run for zone (Alpha send pet for those users).
All the whine for nerfs are made because its overpowering in PvP, almost every change has been made because of that. I dont know how many PvP nerfs ive seen over the year i have played. Still there is a few people that actually learn how to play the game and use their skills to kick ass in pvp.
I could probably live through another nerf of my proffession. But i do not belive alot of other peoples will. U already killed our heals, now u want to nerf us again because of Funcoms incompetence. It kinda makes me upset and ruins the fun i have playing my character. Direct ur "nerf" threads towards something else instead. Redo em and say "we want this" instead of "remove this".
I will leave this thread alone since there is no way to talk to Nothinman because he is stuck on using his weapon and he doesnt want someone to be able to take that away from him.
Just a little advice. Try a Nova Flow max nano resist, dont fight on full aggro.
Have fun with your nerf thread. Im gonna start one against soldiers next time they resist my drains.
weeeeee
I haveto make so many sacrifices to fend of a trader assault that i am pretty useless. I gotta spend my last IP on a dark blue skill (nano resist) to get it only to about 650... almost useless... I have to either give up my 15% scope to fight on def, or keep it and get hit 100% of the time.
after your deprives my attack is so low i miss most of the time.. so i rely on cirts ( i rely on crits alot anyways ) so i use a 15% scope.. thus fighting on anythign other then aggro is rediculous.
anyways, point being that there was/is/are ALOT of people that all agree that traders need some kind of change in pvp. I mean to start off on the most basic level. should a class designed and specialised in tradeskills totally own in pvp? doesnt make alot of sense but then again none of what FC does makes any sense...
when everyone cried against soldiers shield it was nerfed.. when everyone cried agianst soldiers alpha and burst and FA it was nerfed.. when peopel cried about soldiers critting so much and owning pvp. they nerfed crits... do you somehow think that you are immune to the same type of thing happening?
other classes got nerfed for pvp, alot of classes and alot of skills/nano's have been. i dont see why you think you are immune...
and dont say the heal nerf. that was because you were out healing docs.. and you were.. and cried about it when it was changed.
p.s why would you cry nerf on a soldier resisting your nano's? we have dark blue resist that conflicts with everything and we reloy on crits so we cant fight on def (scope)... cry nerf on the nt's then who have 1k resist or fixers..
Last edited by Nothinman; Sep 6th, 2002 at 06:08:16.
oh and I dont play anymore.. im flaming cause school doenst start till monday and...!
http://members.shaw.ca/mike81/back.JPG
Funny part is, if FC would have done what we (all 1st day player) asked when they start talking about nerfing damage, none of those nerf would have ever happened.
There was an easy solution to get rid of insta kills in pvp who was proposed by most of people instead of halving damage, it was to double everyone hp thus making it impossible to insta/alpha kill someone. If that would have taken place, no nerf would have been called neither TMS/FA/Burst, UVC, NF Range, Stuns etc... and it would still be funny pvpin. anywayz
Cocio,
I really have nothing against you personally, i've seen you around and even have friends in TC. Just cause you don't see me PvP doesn't mean I don't. I've had 20+ characters over the past year, EVERY class (except Crat which i admitantly could only play 10 levels before i got tired). I've pvped at some point with each and every one of them.
I'm not selective in my duels (besides not wanting to duel a trader, aka: Suicide). That's why I don't have your uber title, although I have had rookie on two of my characters as i posted before.
I was going to reply to your long post but Nothinman covered everything pretty solid. You make some good points but it all boils down to that each of the classes that you mentioned that will own a soldiers ass is also each owned by the Trader (except the MA who does have a chance).
My only issue with docs is that if damage is 1/2 then so should heals.. doesn't make sense... Put damage back to 100% or drop the heals... period. It's only fair. Does it really make sense to you that the Support/Trade classes in this game rule PvP and the Combat classes are left in the dust?
If you belive that you are truly blinded by your uberness. This is what i belive and if you want to hold that against me ingame then that is up to you.. I could really give two sh*ts.
I've been playing for over a year and i've talked to you maybe once. So if we don't talk again I won't be hurt. If TC wants to blacklist me for wanting to fix PvP (which is so obvious to everyone except the people blinded by their overpowering unfair advantage) then that is fine too.. The hand full of friends i have in TC will still talk to me.. believe that.
I also have AC2 beta downloaded and Neocron (which admitantly sucks)..... so if it gets fixed there is a chance i come back in Nov after my subscription ends in Sept 16th. If it does not get fixed at that time there will be 4 other games to pick from.
You insist on calling it a nerf, but do you really think that is how the game was intended to be played? If so, again, your blinded.
I know several Traders and i'm close with many of those.... and I've had a level 74 Trader myself... but right is right and wrong is plain wrong... Traders owning every class is WRONG.
Tell me, are you scared that if they actually fix the pvp in this game that you will lose your Neophyte?
Also in about 50++ replies the only disagreements have come from Traders..... is there a non-trader who is reading this post that thinks that Traders are not overpowered in PvP? Please Please post if so.
Last edited by hehe :P; Sep 6th, 2002 at 06:54:28.
Hehe, wonder where you got this image from ^^ Anyway yeah soldiers are easy if they're stupid enough to sit and fight me instead of running for the nearest zone with TMS up...But I love the 130 DMG AIMSHOTS I get against traders and the ql70ish heal I get to use...Maybe I should also mention the one time we fought where I had rrfe and 2 tl6 proj bracers and you had no reflect, and you still almost beat me...NERF TRADERS BLIND!Then we move onto the Adventurer. This guy will heal all ur damage while his DMG shield eats on u. His X-3 rifle will also do pretty descent damage while ur MK is up and when it drops u will die or u have to run to a zone.
Nerf?
Btw Lohem, Knas is lvl195
Yagyu for life
Kai,
heyaNice to see you so shortly after you ganked me in Ent Arena LOL
this dumb atrox was actually smart enough to run for arena exitCaught me off guard there, but nice to see that you agree about the situation at hand.
BTW: It's refreshing to see advents succeed in pvp, I'm not at all jaded about you owning my ass
Later
yes Lohem, most traders are blinded by thier uberness... : (
this game is too hard to pick apart in a few threads. there is nearly an infinite number of things to consider.. but there is a bottomline.
and that is that traders really do own everyone.. one on one and in mass pvp.. you may not get quite as many pvp points cause most of you cant alpha strike that well.. but its true.
I resisted a deprive 5 times in a row against a trader equal to my level. (150ish)
My nanoresist is 700ish.
The problem with nano resist is that level of caster or q of nano being cast is not factored into the formule.
Hence nanoresist is useless until u get about 700 ish. But then it rocks at full deff.
So a well played doc is a nasty trader killer
There is no such thing as a bad doctor, only bad teammates.
- Steinur
*whine shine* boohooo
Lohem, are you really unable to answer?
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
A trader can drain you max 415 points.
CHS SMG req: 556
Your SMG skill after divest/plunder advanced: 385
You will be 50% if your smg skill is 800. If it is 805 you will be 75% effective.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I would love to get my hands on those 600+ drains you are getting hit with...
Oh lord I don't want to get into this debate..but...can't resist hitting reply
Unless you are playing a class that has a way to buff there attack rating high then you are most likely going to get oed with your weapon, and even if you have buffs you are still opened to it -450ish is a lot. A trader can deploy 2 drains in roughly 8ish seconds (tho to be fair there is a "chance" you may resist plunder) and once you have both drains running you may as well be lvl 75. From my situation I will be using lvl 60-70 heals, have a 50% oe weapon, and would need to equip a 110ish weapon if I wanted to retain a 100% effectivness, aren't I now more or less lvl 75 ? All I have now is the hp of a higher lvl char (enough to make a run for it or draw out the agony) and watever buffs I had running.
Ofcourse trader drains are unfair in PvP, ofcourse traders are going to defend them, a wee bit of self interest perhaps
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