Preliminary 14.5 patch notes

[Ashuras]

Originally posted by Oljalyn


I know soloing wasn't supposed to be the best way to gain XP. BUT, every now and then it is nice to solo a mission. Soloing top level veterans can be downright impossible for some professions, especially now that bracers are getting nerfed. I know my engie will have great use of her 1k runspeed if two veteran enforcers comes after her in a medium difficulty mission. I won't kill 'em, but I sure can run faster than them!

Yup, solo is definitely not the best way to gain XP. UNfortunately, SOLO is the way many of us have to play (eg. I've been playing since launch, and my main is only level 165... coz I solo A LOT).

U won't survive running away from 2 Vet Enforcers (unless u have full hp). They hit even when they are running.

I'm one of those who will be badly affected by the bracer nerf.

Crap... I don't even have a single tittle 6 bracer. I'm just using a SINGLE tittle 5 melee bracer. (The Vet Enf and MAs hits damm hard... before tittle 5, we don't really need them... but... after that, it's a different story)

Those bracers had helped me SURVIVE so many SOLO missions..... sigh.. I HATE all the NERF MONGERS. I wish FUNCOM nerf JUST YOUR CHARACTER.

Not everybody has the time to team up every day.

My playing time is very restricted, and could only solo most of the time (except weekends). Sigh....

Guess I'll be doing < 50% missions now... or just hit cancel mission if I find 2 enforcers blocking my way to the objective.

Those who only do team will not miss these bracers in PVM. U guys kill the mobs too fast and often have docs. Only solo people like me will miss them badly.

Arrggh... FC, why do u always have to NERF and NERF just because of PVP!

Can't u think of better way to balance than to nerf something by reducing it's effectiveness by 4 time! (from cap of 42% to only 7%). This is much much worse than even the crit buff nerf.

Can't u just make these bracers NOT STACKABLE!!???

[jakesnake5]

Originally posted by eaze


Let me see, soldiers having 99-100% reflect in PvP, everyone with bracers and soldier buff having 72% reflect etc, is this what you call whining? I'd say this is just a fix, you are not supposed to reflect the majority of damage.

Never the less, there are two things to be fixed in PvP, way more important.

Um, maybe I'm missing some secret Sold nano, or your out of your gourd. Sold's TMS is limited, and locks nanos for 2 mins. So if he's using mk X's, he's not casting anything for 2 mins, and his TMS runs out 40 seconds before that, longer if lower mk lvl. The TMS also cancels other reflects.

Besides, the current bracers unbalance pvp horendously.

ie:

2 chars, exactly the same, with same armor, ip distribution, weapons and aggdeff settings. This will be a close fight. now give one 42% bracer mods, and guess who'll win a large percentage of time? Right, bracer man. This is more true with reflect bracers.

To have them reduced to 7% means bracer man may still win most times, but not always. Tactics are involved.

If you leveled your toons based on the power of bracers, your gimped. Live with it, your in the same boat as the rest of us who don't have them.

P.S. I still want to see the big guilds who kill Tarasque fight him now. Will lay odds will take slightly longer or more people.

[Ashuras]

Originally posted by Lucid Flow


If you make such a bold statment, back it up with what you think would be a better fix. I'de love to punch holes in it.

How about this:

Make the reflection effect NOT STACKABLE.

Please punch holes in this alternative suggestion.

[Ashuras]

Originally posted by GreyBear

How about actually finding something useful in the dang mission?

I mean get a clue, game is skill based (or was) so by level 30 Im using atleast lvl 50 Implants, but in mission Im finding lvl 30. Im wearing atleast lvl 40 armor, their dropping lvl 30. Im using as high a weapon as I can get on, their dropping again lvl 30 or lower. Seems like rarely Ill get one of these items atleast 1% higher than the ql of the mission.

LOL... this paragraph reminded me of the "good old days".

GreyBear, ... did u know... that mission chest loots, were only 1/3 the QL of the missions ?

The only use of these loot, was to sell to the shop, and hope to earn enough credits to BUY 2nd hand armor from higher levels.

Higher levels had to sell their armor in order to afford higher QL ones from shop.

THe only other way to get anything of a decent QL, was to get agents to sneak uber high QL missions for them.

Life was really tough then...

Anyway.. sorry for the OT reply.

[Ashuras]

Originally posted by Abalz
OK you all act like reflect bracers were the only thing keeping you alive, if this is true then your character is a big wasted gimp.

Let me see u solo Vet Enf and MAs. See who is the big wasted gimp.

[Greybear]

[__________Lucid Flow]

Originally posted by Ashuras
How about this:

Make the reflection effect NOT STACKABLE.

Please punch holes in this alternative suggestion.

How would that work? Even the best Reflective buff would be a waste of NCU against any given damage type. You're suggesting that lets say you have 42% Reflect Projectile that with RRFE you would have 42% Projectile Reflection with no enhancment?

That doesn't solve anything and it doesn't solve the main complain by Soldiers and Engineers. The complain they have is simply that any profession can get perminant bracers for any given damage type and have a 12% advantage to that.

That is the MAIN complaint. They give too much with no disadvantage. It rips away a primary skill of a profession that relys on them. It would be like having Healing Bracers, or Bracers of Charming. Not something I personally would enjoy.

You're also not considering the logistics of it. How exactly will you make the reflection effect from a bracer not stack with the effect from a buff? It just doesn't work like that. Logistically speaking that isn't even possible without reworking the entire system.

[Greybear]

Ahh good point, never knew that the Soldier or Engi or any other profession couldnt wear those reflectors. Always thought these were rare finds that anyone could have a chance of finding.

[_______________North]

Why don't we just give all the professions all the time on Nullity Sphere without the downside effect of you have to stand still? Lets make it only 99.9% reflect on all damages, so you would be a bit vulnerable....

Thats what bracers basicly where when used correctly together with RRFE, 72% effective Nullity Sphere running on all the time without any side effects the actual nano has.

The most problems of course were at Title levels 5 and 6.

I say this again, not every profession can be a master of PvP, it was never ment so, and it will never be so.

[__________Lucid Flow]

Originally posted by GreyBear
Ahh good point, never knew that the Soldier or Engi or any other profession couldnt wear those reflectors. Always thought these were rare finds that anyone could have a chance of finding.

Anybody can. But Engys and Soldiers HAVE Reflect Nanos, the best for a Soldier is 30% and the Best for an Enigneer is 24%. For soldiers, they get a Short term 75% reflection nano. With Bracers and the 30% buff, ANY profession could walk around with 72% reflection in any given damage type.

The best reflection buff is 75% for a minute and a half with a downside of no nano casting for 2 minutes. With Bracers, 72% was possible with no disadvantage. You see why thats a problem?

[Greybear]

Yeah, that someone actually had to ask others to help them.

I mean if anyone could have them and the Soldier was wereing them with the 75% then wouldnt he actually have over 100% for a short period of time? Wouldnt that have made him better?

But Im not argueing, Im just stating the obvious since I dont know half these numbers everyone is quoting and I dont PvP, I rarely TEAM.

Obviously, Im the one getting screwed the worse. This is supposed to help the PvP aspect of the game, and inturn knocks solo players that havent hurt anyones enjoyment down another rung.

Like was stated by North, Everyone cant be the masters of PvP. And I get a feeling from your posts either ur a Soldier or have been hit by someone using the tatics described.

When I think of Soldiers I picture a tough character taking damage and dishing out bullets by the tons. Not someone casting Programs during battle like they were health kits.

But thru all of this, the Soldier Engi Doc MP Advent Trader etc. etc. etc.... All had the same chances of finding the same items and getting some of the same buffs, so how were these really off Balance?

Id kinda picture this as a TRADER casting a debuff on an Engi buefore the Engi gets a chance to tell his pet to attack. Thus nullifiing the pet in a /follow mode, then using a scope and or crit buff with some kinda shottie on the Engi while he is still trying to figure out which way to run.


There are two sides to any coin, anyway you flip it someone is unhappy. This isnt a coin and can actually land on its side. The object is to figure out something that would work for both sides and push toward it. Its even harder to see it when you know you want it to land on heads and the coin has two heads.

[______Character Zero]

I am not crusty. I'm loving this game. I can't wait for this patch. I can't wait for the boospansion.

Also, ~Chris, why did you take me off your bozo list?? I was enjoying it there, though I must acknowledge being honored to have been removed.

So, what's up with these gems?? What's the real impact of having had these removed from the game? Is it that the tradeskills never worked? Someone with more knowledge than me plz explain.

[Isgrimnur]

Originally posted by Lucid Flow


Anybody can. But Engys and Soldiers HAVE Reflect Nanos, the best for a Soldier is 30% and the Best for an Enigneer is 24%. For soldiers, they get a Short term 75% reflection nano. With Bracers and the 30% buff, ANY profession could walk around with 72% reflection in any given damage type.

The best reflection buff is 75% for a minute and a half with a downside of no nano casting for 2 minutes. With Bracers, 72% was possible with no disadvantage. You see why thats a problem?

" ANY profession could walk around with 72% reflection in any given damage type."

Um NO ANY lvl 190+ player could do that IF they got rrfe in addition to having 2xQl196+ bracers of the same damage type.

Before this was very very rare, how many title 6 people were there? As time passes on, more and more people get to title 6. I just got to title 6 myself, and I have to say I think there should be some reward for being there. IMO making 1/2 the bracers go on left arm and other half right arm only would solve a huge problem. Then AT MOST you could get 21% from a bracer. I have to tell you, I don't have ANY 21% bracers. I have some melee/proj bracers that TOTALLY help me solo. As an agent I am gimped on hps. I have no high lvl MP pets to back me up anymore either. So what do I do? I wear 1xmelee and 1xproj and I FP into soldier mode and throw up RRFE. Yes self buffed, and I solo.

I can tell you that soloing a 192 mission is very possible WITH the bracers and my new X-3 rifle. Before, the last time I soloed I was around 155 and it was before x-3 and before I had good bracers/rrfe. I could barely do 40% missions.

IMO a better solution would be to make soldier/engie reflect line self only and keep bracers the way they are. Seems crit nerf first, now reflect nerf. The game is past 1 year of being live. Those now hitting title 6 deserve some reward for getting there. IMO bracers is one of the only rewards.

Also I agree, doing mobs like tara or lvl 300 bosses without reflect is going to kill the game more for those who aren't the top of their class.

Finally, the person who said after 150 anyone can tank, that is totally not true. MA/Enf/Soldier/Adv and fixer with GA armor can tank very well, some classes fall in the middle, perhaps they have good AC or MKII for hps and can tank, others like NTs, Crats, MPs, Docs can't tank and they are usually gimped till 180+ when mobs just arent so red to them. As an agent I can tank 50% missions now with rrfe, without it I can't really unless there is a doc on the team as I just don't have enough hps. (well for melee ace/real mean anyways)

Seriously, I hope funcom puts this idea on the backburner until 14.6 when they can make a final and reasonable decision on it. 7% is just nothing at title 6. Assuming everyone has rrfe running at all times is the wrong way to go imo. As an agent, i would rather be fping for some xp bonus, not because you, funcom chased all the soldiers away by gimping them, and someone needs to cast rrfe or our 7% bracer gimp arses will take too much heat.

As for the rest, no one has said it so I will:

Where did arul saba go? Why are my gems useless? Why didn't I sell them for a 1mil each last month ( I seriously hope you will UP the vendor value for them to help those of us who paid for some of them to get our money back. (yeah i am kinda cheap)

[_________________mot]

Daaaamn...4 flames and I didn't even see any action

[Beartwo]

Originally posted by GreyBear


When I think of Soldiers I picture a tough character taking damage and dishing out bullets by the tons. Not someone casting Programs during battle like they were health kits.

But thru all of this, the Soldier Engi Doc MP Advent Trader etc. etc. etc.... All had the same chances of finding the same items and getting some of the same buffs, so how were these really off Balance?

Having bracers and healing abilities makes you uber! While reflect buff runs and the bracers are you you are in fact invincible, since a fixer hot or doc hot added to your own healing ability will keep you at 100% hp at all times.

Since soldiers are limited to OMHH and first aid kits we can heal for about 100hp (ohmhh) and first aid for 627 hp. Since we have no discernible advantage in atk rating or alpha strike (this can be rectified through making dmg 100%) it is virtually impossible for a soldier to hurt another player.

The only professions I concider myself able to fight on a one on one basis are agent, NT, and engi. Why? .... none of these profs have heals inherent to their profession, and usually their hp is on the low side.

I might be wishing for the lost days of soldier glory, but the way FC has managed to unbalance the professions in pvp really makes me angry.

TL6 characters have no need for bracers as a reward. They dont need them in Pvm, and they dont need them in pvp.

[Snuble]

MA/Enf/Soldier/Adv and fixer with GA armor can tank very well, some classes fall in the middle, perhaps they have good AC or MKII for hps and can tank, others like NTs, Crats, MPs,

NT's tank (they have to because of their damage output ) Crats tank (the one I play with does at least). MP's tank (pet pathing == no pet == eager to show their worth Docs? Never seen one tank, but then again, all the teams I've been in is overprotecting their doc

[Peisinoe]

Don't know what you're smoking, but as a 162 mp, I can tank quite well. *shrug* That's without reflect bracers. When I throw my bracers on, I can tank better. To be honest, while I don't like this nerf, I'm not going to be exactly whimpering on the ground either. *shrug* Also, haven't met many nts/crats/docs who couldn't tank as well. Or agents. *shrug again* I completely agree with the statement that any 150+ char can tank. And many below that level. (Well, dunno about engis. I've only teamed with one like three times ever in AO.) And acs/hps aren't really a factor. If a player is over 150 without decent ac/hps, it's not his profession's fault. It's his.

What I'm curious about is if Funcom bothered to test 7% for 'pvp balancing' blahblah. Or was this just some arbitrary number they pulled out their butt like they did when they set those level reqs on nanos.

[Myga]

Originally posted by Beartwo


TL6 characters have no need for bracers as a reward. They dont need them in Pvm, and they dont need them in pvp.

So exactly what is the reward for a TL 6 character? 40-50 more in a few skills? Big deal, 1050 or 1100 atk rating. Or 830 instead of 790 evades. Having spent twice the time leveling as a TL 5 char there should be a very significant advantage. But no without bracers a soldier 30-40levels below me will be able to almost instakill me with a alphastrike, is that fair? BS.

[___________Firedrake]

originally posted by Beartwo

TL6 characters have no need for bracers as a reward. They dont need them in Pvm, and they dont need them in pvp.

If you mean do they need as in are they manditory, then probably they don't. But I don't see how nerfing something that someone has put time and effort into getting to sooth the whines of a handfull of crybaby PVPer's (and some soldiers) that can't be bothered to stop writing nerf letters long enough to get them for themselves makes the game better (Note: I do NOT by any means mean all PVPers are useless crybabies, I am only refering to the scum-laden nerfmonger PVPer's and soldiers that are behind this nerf). It seems every patch has a new nerf bought about due to Funcom's trying to placate these whining vermin. What is next, making the supression gas in PVP zones change to 100% for 10 mins of every hour so these whiners can change their Huggies? Heck, why should anyone bother trying to get really good items when sooner or later Funcom will nerf them because of a few mewling infants that incessantly cry that some folks that have things they don't have an advantage.

I can only hope that Funcom rethinks this nerf, or at the very least softens it some by upping the percent. I also hope that in the future they actually try to get some feedback from the ENTIRE player base, instead of the offal that cries for nerfs.

[Belerafon]

I played a couple single player games this weekend for a change (Civilisation 3 and Ghost Recon), I Enjoyed It!!!

That was an eyeopener.

I've been playing AO solidly since february, and the thought of logging in again and joining the levelling treadmill for yet another 2hr team mission to get another number higher just doesn't fill me with me with joy.

I admit this game isn't just about the levelling, theres always Role Playing and you can make your own fun.

I do that too, i'm an officer in Division 3 an RK2 Rping org, we have a sister org named "Vox populi" on the clan side, we try to make our online lives a little more exciting by conducting our own events.

But this in itself can be an uphill struggle..

Coordinating people across timezones

Generating enough interest So that people turn up to scheduled events

The lack of people who are interested in more than getting "Doohickie of wonder" or saying i can equip "Blowdart of doom" at level XX.

Ask yourself the questions i'm asking myself now.

do I enjoy playing this game?

Is the reward at the end worth the time spent to get it?

Will i be a better person for it?
(i'm ranting to a bunch of people i've never met, my sanity is in question at this point).

Whats that bright yellow thing in the sky outside my window?

I am ranting i am fully aware of that fact and yes this is entirely the wrong place for this type of post. But what the hell.

And to break the tradition of countless posts i've seen, no i'm not bloody quiting, My sense of duty to my org and friends in game wont let me.

Just make this game "FUN" please. After all you are called FUNcom or was that meant to be ironic?