Money, gotten completely out of hand?

[_____________Cloudeh]

why dont all of you STFU for one single moment please? Do I have the floor? ..good.


The reason things are now overpriced is becuase of cheater/dupers.


When the first guy made millions from duping, from the first ebay seller/buyers, people would spend more money becuase they had it, they would seel it becuase the person next t you would pay anything for it.

Thus, everyone expect everyone to have millions and sells stuff over priced.

Unlucky for them poor peeps its no win situation.

Im sick of people saying i got my 5 mill in a day doing missions.
dont give me that bull****.
Ive tried doing it and got nowhere near half a million.

So, looks like your only way to be like the rest is join them as it did at the start, go to www.ebay.com search for anarchy online, find 20 mil creds for uh..whats the rate now, 9.99?? and have some fun >

Thats what every player and his uncle is doing.
I was luckily enough too sell one piece at 750k, but thats about it.
Cant remember the last time I sold anything tho, i usually keep it for my future new char..so i dont have to spend a redicolous amount on buying parts.

Oh oh and if you knew how much money has gone in and out of some people you would weep.

Im talking 150Mill + Which is INSANE.

I wish there was a command to find out how much money yoyu have had total and used :/

[Grupert]

Originally posted by Cloudeh


Im sick of people saying i got my 5 mill in a day doing missions.
dont give me that bull****.
Ive tried doing it and got nowhere near half a million.

Well, on weekends doing missions (me lvl84) I can make a little over 1mil, or close to 2 mil for the weekend, and thats from just the mission reward and locate item. That by the way, is from doing about 5 missions.
After say lvl 75, the money does start coming in.
NOTE: What I go after are missions where the reward is a battlesuit, get 237k+ for them from the store machines.
Grupert

[________________Riot]

quite frankly i think if you dont like being poor as a doc then make a new char thats not so poor. ive only played for a week now and i have a lvl 25 soldier very well equiped can do red missions no problem and ive got about 200k saved up. ive yet to have a money problem in this game. and about the whole balance thing i think of it like the little school girl situation and i say again if you dont like it pick another char

[_____________Crymcyn]

Since when are docs these poor non-combat characters who can't do missions? Newsflash, their powerful heals make them one of the more survivable solo professions. I never had a problem with my doc being broke or coming close to having a real problem in a 50% difficulty mission.

[TaintStain]

I currently have these chars that I play:

Borel: lvl 134 Soldier
Kanelgiffel: lvl 105 Crat
plus a lot of lvl 10-40 chars thats just experiments..

Someone allready said this but ill say it again, high lvl chars reek in loads and loads of cash but there is just no were to spend them, treat/nano maybe but that is peanut money.

To that guy who said 5 millions a day is impossible, my current record is 12 million in less then 6 hours, 8 ql 180-200 battlesuits, and my comp lit is 330, so a char with like 700 comp lit would have made maybe 15 millions on these battlesuits...

Only reason I ever go for money these days is to help out guild members to get a yal or whatever. Its not even as I buy stuff from other players, IE ql 125+, as we have no need for money except selling on ebay maybe I just give the stuff to whoever I think need it, as I get the stuff friends dont need but I do, this leads to an accumulation of cash that is more or less ridicuolous.

Recently though I have invested heavily in tradeskills with my crat
and thoose cost a LOT, to make a ql 125 treat lab is like 400k+.

My point here is, make a uber superior shop that sells ql 125+ items, and charge accordingly, because there is nothing as boring as sitting at miss term rolling for several hours to get what you want, this would perhaps get all thoose billions out of circulation, maybe shop of firtune will be like the gamble in DiabloII? that would also stabelize money, because not only can high lvl chars get a lot of cash legally, we all know there is, or at least were, exploits that could make you pretty rich... FC needs a way to get thoose money out of the market.

I play on dim2 btw, and the earliest exploits were fixed by the time it went up so that economy is very very far from that on dim1, on the other hand, we are so few ppl we all know eachother and most stuff is just handed around without any money changing hands, pls come visit us there


And a note on docs, most docs I know are more or less money independant, but at earlier lvl's this was not so, doc spent a LOT of money healing the team hence we made up thing called "doc loot", meaning /team loot all and doc loots whenever he/she is able, this was from like lvl 50-90, any nice players should do the same, healer is the reason you lvl fast, encourage them, same for MA, trader, Adv, if they were healing. Allthough these classses has a better means to care for themself, moneywise..

Just a thougth on things..

Fury

[didymus]

Credits?

Credits sum up most of my problems in this game. I put most of my game time in roleplaying, not missions and hunting. Needless to say, I make very little money. What's even worse is, I never get to buy any new gear, and what used to be a problem is multiplied by now. I can never get the gear or credits to to even make the missions I'm doing. It's too hard, wich makes me even hate this credit issue more.

This game is about fun. I don't get much fun out of doing missions and hunting, it's rather boring. Then some powerplayer says "You gotta work for your money like everyone else" and goes rabbling on about how much they roleplay. This game should be suited for everyone, the mission-hunting haters too . And yes, I have made money in other ways, doing services .. But people are generally too cheap to actually make it worthwile.

Me? I'm not cheap. I usually share what I have and often give money to low levelers. I still have this naive, positive idea that "What goes around comes around", it just hasn't kicked in right yet. I've also put *a lot* of money in my guild.

And what buggers me more is a level 12er screaming "Who's the richest around? ME!! I have 60 million creds!!" No wonder they're rich when they earn money with their higher level characters and have it transferred ..

Well, that's my rant. I'm just a little buggered at the time being


- Foul ole' Ron, head of the beggars' guild.

[Paffy]

Do QL 11 concrete cushions or whatever it is called... +8 str/sta. Will fetch you anything from 100k->1M? depending how desperate people are Usually sold in pairs for better price.

And BTW, 11 is betten than 12 and so on in this case...

Zarch and bunch of other chars between 5-140

[_____________Taldrin]

My 2 ideas...

1) Housing! Make large guild houses that cost up to 1 billion creds. I really like the idea of player built cities. Perhaps ask all players and guilds if they would like a stake in it, then in a new patch add the city with all the pre-purchased houses in it.

2) Equipment degradation. Armor will get damaged, guns will get rusty, planes need refueling. If people needed to pay to maintain their equipment there would be some use for credits at high level other than buying treatment kits and ammo.

[____________Rockpitt]

I want to say the buying credits on ebay is just wrong although I can't offer a solution. I use to be more upset about it early on because of price inflation. I'm not as concerned about it now however. The reason is that there is a regulating phenomenon occuring that offsets inflation. Its called market saturation. Lets say no one in the game has a coat. The first time a coat appears it sells for millions (doesn't really matter where the credits come from). As the market saturates with coats the selling price plummets. Because I'm a Fixer and make my living by selling items (yes, I'm a contributor to market saturation), I watch market prices all the time to see which items are most in demand. As an example, about the time I was able to get coats from missions, a QL 80 Secundus coat went for about 600k. Now you can get em all day long for 250k. Prices also flucuate based on the uber flavor of the month. As an example, once very popular, you can't hardly give tank armor away now. If a player is patient (which in my opinion most are not) the price of almost anything will come down to a reasonable, fair market price. Of course by waiting you will be giving up being "uber" for the 6-8 week period it takes for the market to saturate. The big losers in my opinion are people who spend real money for fantasy money. As I've already mentioned, in about 2 months everyone will be wearing the same thing they are because the price has dropped. Market saturation has occured with every popular item in the game except for discontinued items (ex. Freedom Arms pistols) and mission No Drop items. I guess my point is that while I initially thought inflation was going to be a really problem, I think the market regulates itself.

[____________Rockpitt]

Taldrin, while I think housing might be fun to have in the game, I would just like some furniture, hehe.

As for equipment degradation, I hated that in UO. Keeping my equipment repaired (and eventually having to hord so I would have backups) was like having a real life chore. I like to play the game as much as possible. With finding armor, weapons and implants to upgrade all the time, the last thing I want to do is spend time and cash maintaining them too. In the end I think the only person this hurts is the little guy who doesn't buy his credits on ebay.

Why don't we just impose an income tax. The more money you make the more the government takes. Just like in real life. (Boo, this is just a joke. I'd like to think I could be rich one day too)

[Peep]

I have read though all the posts and seen a lot of misconceptions. A little about myself first I am a level 84 Doc, level 85 engineer, level 90 Trader and a level 60 fixer.

Doctor and money.
My Doc cannot support herself at all. She cannot kill gray mobs so is unable to do missions and out of my 4 characters is the most expensive to support. When my doc teams she is a very good healer but if there are to be two deaths in the team you can bet money both times it is the doc. A day spent team hunting with the doc will cost around 100k in nano packs that’s 200 nanos at 25k per 50 Q90 and she will probably get 25k in loot making a net loss of 75k.

Engineer and money.
This character supports the other 3 and with some good buffs can take on red mobs. Missions are not a problem although they are extremely frustrating due to pet pathing problems. Mainly though my engineer will kill green mobs outdoors to get monster parts that my doc can convert to blood plasma this is only because I find missions so mind numbly boring and will do almost anything not to have to do another mission.

Fixer and money.
Missions is the only real option here and can only really take on green to slightly yellow mobs even though she is well provisioned thanks to the engineer out of all my characters this is the cheapest to maintain.

Trader and money.
I have high hopes for this character once I can cast the 132 wrangle but so far has been fairly expensive to maintain due to the cost of nano crystals. Haven't done many missions with this character due to the money supplied (and the fact missions are so boring) by the engineer but have found her better at them than the fixer. Again apart from the sale of wrangles missions are the only other way of getting income.


Ebay.
Forget blaming Ebay for inflation persons selling money here are circulating it a different way. The money is still out there it has only changed hands within the game.

Inflation.
I think one of the major causes of inflation would be that there is no real high level content. Once your character hits level 80 things become boring fast and one way to maintain interest I have found is to make new characters. So here you have a level 10 character running about with 10 million credits kindly supplied by a level 120 alt. On the home shopping channel you see a Q34 gun that should be worth 10k (3 hours worth of missions for a level 10) but you are not really a level 10 you are a level 120 so 10k is nothing to you. All of a sudden you find the guns going for 50k due to the demand and the ability to pay.


Suggested fixes:

- High level alts causing low level inflation....have no idea

- Character balance for earning income:

Missions:
When generating the mission make the booth assign the difficulty/color/xp of the mob not to the characters level but on the characters combat potential, level and profession. This way a doc might be able to do a mission again as the gray mobs are now yellow. One problem here is that teams will make the docs get the missions so the reds are now easy kills but there should be a way around that like it only works on a solo setting and teams will not function.

Doctor’s combat and cost:
Cut down on nano recharge cost but having a self-only HE nano. Maybe a nano like a stun nano that can buy time for the doc's team to get the aggroed monster off. Or stasis nano that makes the doc invulnerable for 10 seconds but cannot move fight or heal.

[_________haniblecter]

The guy above me has the idea about what is happening.

Those that think its wrong that people sell on ebay are most likely those that are too lazy to put hte time and effort to accumalate millions to sell.

The real reason for inflation is the lack of high level content and ability to blow millions of credits on better weapons and items.

-- a fix for this is to continue weapon grades up to QL300.

- Make more High level areas in out of the way areas that contain many OP's that sell high level goods.

- Allow specail clothing that can be worn over armor that looks cool. Make it disgustinly expensive yet cool enough for people to spend 100k or more on.

- Create specail extremely high level Unique items that can be traded. Put level caps on them at the high end, 150+, this will force people to fork over millions for that uber item

Just some fixes on my mind.

[Flapsie]

Is there any info on the "Shop of Fortune" ?
Could that be used for high QL items ?

[_____________Paldorr]

The economy is fine. Stop asking for a nerf!

Money sinks are OK as long as they are worth the cost.

Do NOT put in any degradation of items or maintenance fees - that mistake should have been buried with UO. Even AC is having to re-think it's maintenance fees on villas and mansions.

Look, just because you don't have a lot of money is no reason to let your jeolousy show and punish players who have earned it. Go out and earn it yourself! If they could do it, so could you.

[________________Crin]

People who think the economy is fine are mistaken. AO has the economy of a third world country where you would have to carry your money around in a wheel barrel just to have enough to buy lunch.

I have always liked the idea of maintenance costs for equipment and that items will eventually become useless. DAoC has this just right. If items don’t have an infinite lifespan then they can be made easier to obtain. So instead of having to buy all of your items, you could actually get them by hunting. Loot would become meaningful again. Even trade skills could get a boost because the process for making items could be made easier.

Karma had a good idea about upgrading weapons for a fee at vendors. I’ll take it one further. How about having your weapon/item customized to your character for a fee? The effect would be to raise the QL of the item and make it NODROP. The fee will take money out of the game and the NODROP will take the item out of the game.

Even though it is probably too late to do it, I would like to have hard caps on the amount of money that a player could have in their bank account based on their level. That way it would be harder for higher level players to generate the extra cash and to twink out their lower level players. Yes, I know it would still happen, but it would require more work. So even if a player could dupe a 200 million credits, they would never be able to hold it

[__________starknaked]

For those who aren't sure how to make money:

Blitz missions, or fight your way through if you can. Do small cave missions.

Do missions for rewards that are worth money, not for some random crap. Figure out what the desirable items are that will sell well.

Battlesuits, of course, sell for a lot to the stores.

MP nanocrystals like infuses, mocham's gift, pets, they sell well. Trader crystals above q125 like wrangles do also. 1 million credits each for some of these is not uncommon.

q188 OET Ranee's, an agent weapon, sell for 5 million credits at the least. Same with q200 stigma rifles. There are many other items which sell for a lot, these are just the few I am most familiar with.

The way to make money from missions is not for the cash reward from the mission, it's from the items you get, if you choose the mission rewards carefully.

[Megabio]

Exactly Stark.. For example; by camping the mission terminals at level 10 and getting concrete cushions (they still drop?) than you can get a lot of money. At the least they will sell for 200k each.
~Chris

[______________Tormac]

Here's the problem with the economy...

80% of the players over level 110-120 have most of the equipment they need until 200. All the money they make from there on out is stockpiled....

this causes several problems...

1. they can afford to pay huge sums for low level equipment for "toons" or low level friends.

2. #1 drives the prices up.

3. Because of #2, low levels (without assistance) can't afford to buy from other players.

4. Because of #3, low levels (without assistance) are forced to buy from the shops (expensive) or do missions for similar level equipment that you have to do CONSTANTLY because you outgrow them so fast.

5. Some professions have it harder than others when doing missions.


An example of the auctioning insanity...the flavor of the month is an Atrox MP wielding a support beam. level 100+ rerolls a MP...they can afford to pay huge sums of money to get that beam. So a QL 30 beam sells for 150k.....now how absurd is this? QL 60 beams i have seen going for 300k...and so on.


High levels need a money sink so they won't take away from the low level economy. level 15 MP's running around with 10 million credits ruin the "trade" economy of low level players who don't have outside help.

[________________Xira]

Originally posted by atli

As in real life, earning money takes damn hard work. Higher lvls should be rolling in it, they have put in a lot of hard work and time.

Um...But it's not real life jim....

I have run full easy missions for 6000 creds from tir to newland, sure its boring and repititive - think of it as WORK.

atli.

time*effort= credits.

When I work I expect to get paid. You know so I can buy drugs....RL drugs not game drugs. Or at least women when my drugdealer is in the pokie.(Real women, dammit, not game women:P)

-Xira Arien

[________________Xira]

Originally posted by Scumbug
i like the idea of houses.
costing insane amounts of money of course.

not just placeable anywhere ..
dont want to mess up the exisiting gameworld.

How about placeable in any less than 75% zone but destroyable?

Ahhh shadowbane,...PLEASE COME OUT SOON!!!(But not too soon, we don't want another AnarhcyOn...err....OK bad thing to post on this board)

-Xira ARien