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Thread: ADDED 13.4 : Auto attack bug fixed

  1. #21
    Originally posted by gardner1
    If the "Attacked by" message gets sent as I am trying to cast Glacial Advance, for instance, i will be completely vulnerable for 8+ seconds. Meanwhile I might get Dimached, or Slammed.

    In my opinion, SINCE YOU TOOK RANGE AWAY FROM A RANGED ATTACK CHARACTER CLASS, then you must not allow the target to recieve the "Attacked by.." message until the nano has FINISHED being cast.

    All other classes can instantaneouly cause damage to an NT, the "Attacked by.." message just being a formality to the initation of contact. But an NT must wait for the attack portion of a nano is cast before he can then make his next move.
    If a soldier pops around a corner with his Sunburst Mk-IV, sees me, and hits attack, do you know what happens?

    Attacked by Player xxxxxx...

    But you know what? His Sunburst Mk-IV has a long charge up , and for that entire charge up time, I've already known he was attacking, even though he hasn't shot me. And while he can move wihle it's charging, he must stand still to shoot and if he's accidentally moving when the opportunity to shoot passes, he doesn't shoot period.

    Feel free to and try to resonably explain why you should be able to start 8-second nukes without any warning - and as soon as you do, I'll tell you why my soldier will be allowed to start charging his 7-second Sunburst Mk-IV without warning to you.

  2. #22
    you already explained it for me friend. You can move, i cannot, i am a sitting target.

  3. #23
    Originally posted by gardner1
    you already explained it for me friend. You can move, i cannot, i am a sitting target.
    Ok, so let's say I dance around as a soldier - because I'm prancing around, your nanoformula will miss right? That MA's dimach will whiff right? That enforcer's beam won't crit right?

    *BZZZZT*

    Wrong answer! It means nothing that the solider can move while his gun is charging - whether he stood still or moved a little, his rolls against attacks are the same. He has to stand still to fire, period.

    The only thing not being able to move changes is that you either A) cannot get out of range of their attack or B) cannot get in range to attack them. With this simple point in mind, the only purpose (in a simplified sense) of moving in combat is to chase after the enemy or to run from them - and guess what? If a soldier is running away, he has to stop to shoot, and he's left exactly the same place you are. If he's chasing, guess what? He has to stop to shoot. Just like you.

    You're not one iota more vulnerable than the soldier is when attacking, period. So unless you want soldiers to be able to initiate attacks without warning, your request is 100% unreasonable.

  4. #24
    Hate to play Devil's Advocate, but actually having the Soldier's shot (for example) announce itself on impact rather than on warm-up is just as reasonable and realistic as the proposal for NFs. Granted, changing both would be a fairly significant modification of how things are currently done.

    As an aside, I still think the dominant problems with realism and balance stem from all 'special attacks' being instantaneous, not with weapons/NFs taking too long to charge up.


    Sathar
    36 Neutral Sol NT RK-1

  5. #25

    get your facts straight

    quote:
    -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    If a soldier pops around a corner with his Sunburst Mk-IV, sees me, and hits attack, do you know what happens?
    Attacked by Player xxxxxx...

    But you know what? His Sunburst Mk-IV has a long charge up , and for that entire charge up time, I've already known he was attacking, even though he hasn't shot me. And while he can move wihle it's charging, he must stand still to shoot and if he's accidentally moving when the opportunity to shoot passes, he doesn't shoot period.
    ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    That's just plain wrong, ok if he is going for a regular shot it is, but do you know any soldier that would not start with one of his specials first? those are instant shots if he has not used em before (wich is pritty likely in my book)

    so he does fling shot, burst and if the gun allows it full auto all in the time it takes for you to get that attacked by player xxxx message.

    personally if i see someone around the corner i hit my specials not attack, wasting time on that attack button is useless since it automatically goes on the moment i hit fling shot or any other special

    Meanman level 36 soldier
    Menuet level 13 Nano technician

  6. #26

    NT "special"

    What if we NT's got a "special" also?

    Call it a moment of intense concentration and that we can for but the briefest of instants cast a particular nuke instantaneously, making it comparable in our lvl range to other "specials" obtained thru weapon use by non-casters. This of course constitutes great strain and thus a recharge time of between 5 and 10 minutes to get the concentration back.

    Just an idea really - a thought. Nothing more mothing less.

  7. #27

    ...

    Special nuke? No. A general, high cost buff (for balance) that allows the next nano you cast to happen close to instantaneously? That'd rock.

  8. #28

    Lightbulb Idea

    What about the ability to "hold" a nano for some time before letting it loose?

    Lets say I start a nano and instead of targetting someone it forms an icon I can drop for later use just like those specials.

    Only one of course

    That way we do have a quick and easy way to start a fight after wich things resume as normal.

    I would not even mind if this was disabled if I have a weapon with specials in my hands myself.


    Meanman level 36 soldier
    Menuet level 15 Nano technician

  9. #29
    If they could integrate a new NT special into the game (the above ideas being great starts) that would go a long way to even that part up... but I don't know if FunCom would go for that.

    I'm thinking if they did, it would be kinda like a long-range brawl that consumed a teeny bit of nano and had a not-to-long skill recharge (20s? 25s?) that used Matter Creation as the damage calc stat (in a similar way Brawl uses Brawl) to deal damage? It of course, would lock the MC skill, as Brawl locks Brawl.

    Or - for variation of use, make them similar to MA moves. Call them canned formulas, and they do a set amount of damage at a variable range. They'd require a bit of MC skill, and would come in various damage-dealing types, none of which have any cast time, and could be hit as other profession specials in relation to casting - not during attack charge, but any time during charge-down or non-casting. They would lock MC skill for varying periods of time.

    The question is, how would FunCom keep other professions from running out and using these? With a soldier having MC skill as a requisite for his reflect sheild, what's to stop him from nabbing a low-level nano-nuke-in-a-can as it were? My guess, make these NT only.

    That rambling aside, yeah a soldier charging up a long-charge gun can start the attack with a fling shot before any charging, and in my opinion that's incorrect game mechanics...

    My opinion? Soldier should be able to fling shot, burst, or full auto only ONCE during any given up/down charge of the weapon - being able to fling shot, burst, and full auto before your attack meter has risen for the first shot is bull, period. Simply make it so they'll have to wait for the next charge up to do the next special - can't call that a nerf at all, it's just making it so you can't all do them in a 0.5 second time span.

    As the gun charges up, they can not fling shot - soon as it hits peak, done charging - they can use any one of their specials, but only one... after charging down, it begins to charge, and again, after it hits peak, they can use any of their specials again.

    That would be fair, having to wait for the charge up properly, and not being able to dump all your specials at once. The same applying to MA's and enforcers as well - No brawl/dimach/Blessed with Thunder insta-combo should be doable by MA's. One special per weapon cycle, only after it's completed charge up.

    Ah, who am I kidding though... we probably won't see that happen.

  10. #30

    Unhappy Disappointing

    To be honest I rather just stop my attack with button. Now super gimped in pvp. It might have been okay to do this if NT's had range but now range is just the same as must ranged weapons. So by the time I get that first nuke off good old agent probably hit a few times usually meaning i'm pretty much dead. I give up on my NT and pvp just no fun anymore..

  11. #31

    Re: Disappointing

    Originally posted by Blanch
    To be honest I rather just stop my attack with button. Now super gimped in pvp. It might have been okay to do this if NT's had range but now range is just the same as must ranged weapons. So by the time I get that first nuke off good old agent probably hit a few times usually meaning i'm pretty much dead. I give up on my NT and pvp just no fun anymore..
    This is exactly where i am my friend also...unfortunately.

    I logged on to see the SantaLeet...but nothing else really captures my attention anymore.

    I have no advantage in PvP....previously, even w/ the advantage, it really was just on paper anyway, as I was never high level enough to use all the additions to make myself "uber" as everyone claims the NT's are (which is pure bull...just ask or read Garzu's posts, or just look around the PvP field for who are the Rookies/Novices - seldom are they NT's) There were a few NT's who *cough* used advantages - I guess that's the nice way of putting it - and led to the nerfing of our class...thx guys...glad to see I left AC to step into the same muddy waters.

    Lanasia, i like your style, you have very good thoughts on evening things out, It is just a point of reference for me though, that as a class, one that I chose, having the weakest HP's and AC's, I should be able to make you fear me, if you are not attentive to my presence. If you are, I should RUN! If i let a soldier or any other class besides the Agent within my range, I should die pretty quickly, which has been my experience in PvP, and Ive always been ok with that. I NEVER have whined about having low HP's or AC's and dying because I stood toe to toe w/ a power class, that would be just plain stupid of me to do so.

    But i have a hard time, with other professions, who dont want to see the NT have any advantage that would be commensurate of their skills/lack of skills.

    If Funcom wants us to be sitting ducks, which is what they obviously DO want us to be, then by GOD, we should have THE MOST POWERFUL and FASTEST attacks of anyone on the planet...you SHOULD fear us. Not say to yourself, "hehe, that tickled...oh, an NT, haha," Fling, Burst, FA...so much for him...

    So, i do not mind your suggestion of putting specials for F, B, and FA on more of a delay, but that would be a nerf, and even I dont want to see gun classes get nerfed. I feel that is just poor problem solving on Funcom's part. Always have. All they have to do is fix that no one can land a nuke from 81m or beyond...and if you do get hit from a nuke from someone who is at the edge of their range, then you should automatically have them hard targeted, and a large arrow appear on the screen pointing which direction that attack just came from....boom, you run toward the arrow and get in range while the NT is powering up the next nuke, and Fling, Burst, FA, boom, you are now both at about the same health point. Then it comes down to tactics and keyboard skill on who will survive.

    "should i run, should i heal, should I cast Layered Protection, should I blind and root and run then heal, bla bla" NT thinks...

    "should I run, should i heal, shoudl I cast MK shield, should I wait out the 30s before I get my 2/3 specials back and hope i can heal again after that, bla bla," the sodier thinks.

    The NT's advantage is now gone, the battle is on. The only thing that the NT special would do now, is give the NT more of an advantage, and that would not be fair either.

    SO, back to reality, there is no range advantage, and as far as Funcom cares, there wont be one, which IMHO is pure bull****.

    This is why i havent PvP'd in so long, there are so many things wrong, and with each patch, even more things wrong, with all professions. it has become a joke. and PvP is what was supposed to make this game. unfortunately it is what is breaking this game.

  12. #32

    Re: Re: Disappointing

    Originally posted by Noe


    If you are, I should RUN! If i let a soldier or any other class besides the Agent within my range, I should die pretty quickly, which has been my experience in PvP, and Ive always been ok with that. I NEVER have whined about having low HP's or AC's and dying because I stood toe to toe w/ a power class, that would be just plain stupid of me to do so.
    oops, i wasnt too clear w/ this. I should say, there is one class that should either be able to one shot, or come close to one shotting me, the AGENT. That is not to say i think they should be able to have like a 3500 AS at L50 that's just insane, and is cause for some moderation w/ the upcoming over-equipping issues....but the whole 40% of total on aimed shot i think sucks for them, cuz they should have that adjusted to near 90% of total HP on any characater, should they have the sane gun and sane skill enough to pull it off (ie, a char who might be at the higher edge of level restriction to engage me)

    A long casting large nuke, dealth from range and stealth
    An Aimed Shot w/ all concentration, etc from an Agent
    A Dimach
    The collective total of a Fling, Burst, FA and regular shot

    all these should IMHO almost kill you.

  13. #33

    Thanks!

    Now that I don't auto-attack I can try to better my (6 mob) Root-calmed overpull record!!!

    IMHO, Calm is one of the best NT programs. It saves doc's more effectively thank any other program other than crat-root (crats rule they just dont know it yet).



    a

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