Shadowland

[BoomDoom]

Originally posted by Krabbus
Even if it's easy to implement the code Thugdoom is talking about I don't think Funcom will make the changes in the fundamental gamemechanics available for Shadowplayer only.

Krabbus, let me ask you something. Are you on this planet? Do you get that there will be balanced. Expansion pack guys will be balanced against other expansion pack guys and non expansion pack guys will be balanced against non expansion pack guys (as much as they are now at any rate). If you REFUSE to BUY the new OPTIONS you DO NOT get them!! Are you dense? Its pay to play. That means if you pay you get to play. you paid for Anarchy online, super, that means you get to play it. You pay for your monthly service, that means you can continue to play on their servers and in their "maintained" world. You have not paid for Shadowlands therfore you dont get to use the stuff in it. Period, end of story, done, finished, THE END. Wrap your brain around that concept and beat your head against the wall until it sinks in.


A Fundamental gamemechanic can be like this:
- A change in the skillsystem, that make it easier to survive, eg.: specialize in First Aid in you are able to heal more and that will prevent you seeing the Reclaim Terminal as often as a normal player will (same profession and level). This will make you level faster.

So what? You don't pay for the feature you don't get it. Its as simple as that.


- A change on how much experience you get for each kill. First of all they can't make shadowplayer mobs easier to kill than normal AO mobs since this will make the shadowland players level faster, and again it will unbalance the game between the Rubi-Ka and shadowland (and of course between the players)

How ignorant are you? I've already explained that that example you keep using (taken from one of my posts) was completely misunderstood by you and you keep using your misunderstanding as if it was a fact. Re-read what i wrote and then read my response to you.


- Teamlevel range, lets say they are increasing the range in team so you can let lower people team with higher levels. That will also unbalance the game if it's only implemented in one version.

Good, that would be a great feature that I'd pay $20 for just to have that.

and so on...

I hope the list continues basuically forever. It would be better that way. The more i get for my $20 the happier i am. I might even start to PVP just to blow you away a few times and listen to you whine about the unfairness of the guy that bought the expansion pack and contributes to Funcom's financial future having more options then the guy that refuses to for some half though out inane principal.

Funcom will never go the opposite direction when Shadowland arrives, so they are going to implement fundamental gamemechanic changes in both versions - to make the game as much balanced they can. [/QUOTE]

They will and they should. Anything else is financial suicide. Why dedicate 30 people to a project that will have an endresult of zero? IF you can get everything from the expansion pack without paying for it why even go through the expense of selling it?

Krabbus, where are you from? You've noted that your english isn't good so i am assuming your from Europe (just because i'm under the impression that most of the non-us customers are from Europe). I'm wondering, were you raised as a socialist or something? Because you seem enamoured with the concepts of socialism and anti-capitalism to any degree. Please, illuminate me. Which archaic and broken idealolgy of socialism do you practice?

[Tekkers]

I play AO a pretty longer time then I was expecting, so I like it, not everyday but who wants to eat everyday te same, so FC can't do everything for ya, or they can come prepare your food also duh.
So if you had bought Quake III and then there is come an expansion on, what happend there are many skill'z and new playfields you can't use anymore with the original, I never heard somebody complain about that, why would you do it here.
Even if there is an dimension where you can't come and where new item's popup, it's intressting for the economy in RK, so I am in for it all the way even if I couldn't buy it, wich I gonna do with or without ya. °-)

I think making another dimension is just SOOOOO stupid cause I like to have all on one dimansion, the more players the more plesant it become.
So everybody who wants another dimension pls think, you can't find anybody online here in Europe over day.

Another thing if you gonna quit because there is coming an new expansion whereyou need to pay extra for, I think it's no big loosse because you wouldn't stay much more eventually, this is improvement off the game and RK so don't be against it, just be for it, if you can buy it or not, it's just selfish.
Imaging there would only be an expansion to be sold in US cause there isn't just marketing here in Europe I still won't say will quit AO because I like it.
There is an difference in all this when they can sell an copy off AO in Europe (original) then they need to fullfill there duty buy placing good servers and stuff, but iff there is an only US EXPANSION (not update) I won't quit for sure, I even like it then you need to earn more cash to buy the stuff they collect in Shadowland LOL that's just part off the game.
I am sure in reallife there are places where you don't have the money for to go to, and I am sure you do because you complain on a expansion from 20$ so are there for kill your self or something like that?

I am not wining on your person just on your thought, need to say I didn't read all this messages, so if you changed your mind pls don't be angry I am not saying all this to make you angry just to keep you in RK.


byebey

[Krabbus]

Originally posted by Thugdoom
Krabbus, let me ask you something. Are you on this planet? Do you get that there will be balanced. Expansion pack guys will be balanced against other expansion pack guys and non expansion pack guys will be balanced against non expansion pack guys (as much as they are now at any rate).

This must be the dumbest comparison I ever have seen, I agree that exp will be balanced against other exp users, and non-exp users will be balanced to other non-exp users. BUT I'M NOT TALKING ABOUT THAT - READ MY POSTS YOUR IGNORANT FISH (hehe) What about the balance between exp-users and non-exp users - THAT'S THE REAL PROBLEM.

You want to be in the same dimension/playfield as I'm in, but you have fundamental advantages since you are playing Shadowland (such as skillspecialization, and perhaps teamlevel range, XP bonus etc)... do you see the problem? If not I'm wondering what kind of society you are living in...

If you REFUSE to BUY the new OPTIONS you DO NOT get them!! Are you dense? Its pay to play. That means if you pay you get to play.

Jupp, that's fine by me too, but not if you can use the advantages in the fundamental gamemechanic in my apartment, or in my mission, or where I'm PvPing... If you want to be in the same dimension/playfield as normal AO players you have to have the same set of rules, final... do you get that??? If not will the game be unbalanced!!!

A Fundamental gamemechanic can be like this:
- A change in the skillsystem, that make it easier to survive, eg.: specialize in First Aid in you are able to heal more and that will prevent you seeing the Reclaim Terminal as often as a normal player will (same profession and level). This will make you level faster.

So what? You don't pay for the feature you don't get it. Its as simple as that.

That will be the same as paying FC for a copy of the old ELLTS, it will unbalance the game.

- A change on how much experience you get for each kill. First of all they can't make shadowplayer mobs easier to kill than normal AO mobs since this will make the shadowland players level faster, and again it will unbalance the game between the Rubi-Ka and shadowland (and of course between the players)

How ignorant are you? I've already explained that that example you keep using (taken from one of my posts) was completely misunderstood by you and you keep using your isunderstanding as if it was a fact. Re-read what i wrote and then read my response to you.

I'm not ignorant, I have seen your post, this is just an example of a change in the gamemechanic. As you can see I have posted 3 examples of what a change in the fundamental gamemechanic can be like.

- Teamlevel range, lets say they are increasing the range in team so you can let lower people team with higher levels. That will also unbalance the game if it's only implemented in one version.

Good, that would be a great feature that I'd pay $20 for just to have that.

That feature is fine if you can't do it in my playfield/dimension... if you can do it in Shadowland then I'm fine by that... But if you can do it everywhere and normal AO players can't do it - it will again unbalance the game.

Funcom will never go the opposite direction when Shadowland arrives, so they are going to implement fundamental gamemechanic changes in both versions - to make the game as much balanced they can.

They will and they should. Anything else is financial suicide. Why dedicate 30 people to a project that will have an endresult of zero? IF you can get everything from the expansion pack without paying for it why even go through the expense of selling it?

Nope, they will never do that, why did they remove the ELLTS? Fundamental gamemechanics will be implemented in both versions, but new gameengine (graphicengine), new playfields, items etc will be only available for Shadowland players, ok???

Krabbus, where are you from? You've noted that your english isn't good so i am assuming your from Europe (just because i'm under the impression that most of the non-us customers are from Europe). I'm wondering, were you raised as a socialist or something? Because you seem enamoured with the concepts of socialism and anti-capitalism to any degree. Please, illuminate me. Which archaic and broken idealolgy of socialism do you practice?

I'm from norway

What I'm saying, this is a roleplaying game - a game can't have artificial intelligence so a stripped-off player have to be equal if they are going to live with each other. The difference between the players will of course be their levels, allocation of IP Points, and items.

I see that you don't know what a roleplaying game really is, Rubi-Ka is a seperate world from the world we live in, and the people in Rubi-Ka really don't have any hosts (you and me playing the game) that can make their life better. What you are saying is that a hosts can pay the creator of this world (Funcom) to make the life of some Rubi-Ka people a bit easier. If you do understand what a roleplaying game is, then you understand that a hosts can't be a part of the game - so why the heck should US Dollars make the path for the people of Rubi-Ka??? You really can't bring your world into this fantasy world...

If you think the people in Rubi-Ka have hosts will this be the same as saying that God are controlling your life!

Originally posted by Tekkers
(...) So if you had bought Quake III and then there is come an expansion on, what happend there are many skill'z and new playfields you can't use anymore with the original, I never heard somebody complain about that, why would you do it here. (...)

Ok Tekkers, but could Q3 Expansion Players play with normal Q3 Players? I don't think so... so there isn't really a problem there.

The problem with the Expansion Pack for AO is that they will allow Shadowland players to be in the same playfields as normal AO players - therefor they can't have different set of rules (rules = gamemechanic)

[BoomDoom]

Krabbus:

You're completely ignorant of the way anything works. You don't understand that expansions expand the game and that people that don't pay them don't get them. You don't understand that's the way it should be. You don't seem to get that in order for it to be any other way it is not possible for game companies to create and market expansions. You don't get that there is no reason to balance non expansion players against expansion players. You don't understand that everyone has the option of getting the expansion so if you don't have the same options i do its your fault and nobody elses. You seem to think that I'm the one that doesn't understand anything about "role=playing" but you're the one that keeps crying about being killed in PVP by someone with something you don't have. You seem to think that the unbalance created by the LLTS is the same thing as the gamebalance created by refusing to buy an expansion pack. Krabbus, I hope you're very happy living in your mom's basement collecting welfare checks and living on the socialized practices of Norway, because you are obsiouslly qualified to do that and nothing else (except perhaps being a univeristy professor, since they seem to slant that way as well).

I don't here you thumping your head against the wall trying to beat sense into yourself....

[______________Zindel]

Are you guys married or something?

[Krabbus]

Originally posted by Thugdoom
(...) You don't seem to get that in order for it to be any other way it is not possible for game companies to create and market expansions.

OMG, the set of rules that are affecting every single player at Rubi-Ka are nothing to what you will get in the Expansion Pack. What will you say about a whole new "graphic engine" that will make your game run smoother and faster, a new world (shadowland) that only exp-users can access, new great items that only you can use, etc etc - isn't that enough. Don't you want everyone playing the game under same set of rules when we can bump into each other?

What you really are saying that you want to level faster and easier than non-exp user, that is so selfish.

You don't get that there is no reason to balance non expansion players against expansion players.

It has to be balanced if we can run into each other...

You don't understand that everyone has the option of getting the expansion so if you don't have the same options i do its your fault and nobody elses.

Again, if they change the rules you are kinda forced to buy it if you want to keep playing it, it's just a principle - money isn't an issue for me.

You seem to think that I'm the one that doesn't understand anything about "role=playing" but you're the one that keeps crying about being killed in PVP by someone with something you don't have.

That was one of the first posts by me, and I agree that items and armor should only be for exp-users, but we should still playing under the same set of rules. You can't say that you are allowed to do something that others can't do in a society - every society have laws and they are equal for everyone, but you don't want it to be like that.

Krabbus, I hope you're very happy living in your mom's basement collecting welfare checks and living on the socialized practices of Norway, because you are obsiouslly qualified to do that and nothing else (except perhaps being a univeristy professor, since they seem to slant that way as well).

I'm not even going to comment this, what a childish behaviour... It's common knowledge that people commenting others are taking some parts from their own life...




The connection between the hosts and people in Rubi-Ka
Rubi-Ka is a seperate world from the world we live in, and the people in Rubi-Ka really don't have any hosts (you and me playing the game) that can make their life better. What you are saying is that a hosts can pay the creator of this world (Funcom) to make the life of some Rubi-Ka people a bit easier. If you do understand what a roleplaying game is, then you understand that a hosts can't be a part of the game - so why the heck should US Dollars make the path for the people of Rubi-Ka??? You really can't bring your world into this fantasy world...

If you think the people in Rubi-Ka have hosts will this be the same as saying that God are controlling your life!

[BoomDoom]

Originally posted by Krabbus



I'm not even going to comment this, what a childish behaviour... It's common knowledge that people commenting others are taking some parts from their own life...

No its not. The thing is you've grown up in a welfare state socialized lifestyle and you've been taught since childhood that everything must be equal. That you continue to believe that is true in every sense means you have not been exposed to earth yet.

Go live in your fantasy land. I'm tired of your ignorance and you inability to understand reality. Balance isn't important. The simple reason is because the lack of balance will likely result in sales, which is the goal of any company. Unfortunately there will always be people who think they're entitled to things for free. Some people call them profressive thinkers, some people call the socialists, i call them whiners, and they are you.

[____________Dominata]

I love this thread.
Thugdoom and Krabbus, do not stop your bickering, please...
You two have an amazing insight in what will and will not be in the expansion. One of you must have talked to Cosmik and the other to CZ.

Sorry for butting in, please continue.

/me leans back and waits to be amused.

[BoomDoom]

Originally posted by Dominata
I love this thread.
Thugdoom and Krabbus, do not stop your bickering, please...
You two have an amazing insight in what will and will not be in the expansion. One of you must have talked to Cosmik and the other to CZ.

Sorry for butting in, please continue.

/me leans back and waits to be amused.

No, one of us wants to pay Funcom to develope new options for the game and the other wants to boycott all future products and cry that he doesn't have the same options as people that pay money. I obviously have no idea what Funcom will do in the future, but from the press release and simple economic law i can infer what they should do. Krabbus just wants the world to be a perfect utopia where everyone is equal.

[__________Planetstar]

ok, I've read a bunch...probably too much...

here's the gyst of it all in my viewpoint....what he's trying to say is....

if the expansion only puts availability of certain new or uber items to only those who buy it, those who don't really care to see the new areas, new sounds etc will be "unbalanced"

picture being in a pvp zone & have some kick ass armor on & some greenie or grey player comes up & wastes you in one shot cause he has the expansion & got a new toy....considering you're probably 20 lvls higher, this would be an outrage...new guns=new armor to resist that dmg....so here's an old player without access to that armor & an expansion player with access to the armor & guns.
I think I narrowed it down a bit....personally, expansionwise Everquest did well with...all new items, new races, etc, could be seen or used by old players....but unless you had the expansion you couldn't create that race or get to the new areas of gamefield. In my opinion, that's how it should be for those of us on Anarchy...I don't have any charcters near max lvl, so I won't be buying the expansion for some time, I can understand the original threads viewpoint all too well.

It's not always about the money, it only sounds that way....

[BoomDoom]

It is always about the money, for the company. They need to provide their player base with a reason to buy the expansion. And that reason is, if you don't buy it people will have things you don't have. Its not unfair. Its not mean. Its business, and its what you do when you don't want to go out of business.

[Krabbus]

Originally posted by Thugdoom
No, one of us wants to pay Funcom to develope new options for the game and the other wants to boycott all future products and cry that he doesn't have the same options as people that pay money. I obviously have no idea what Funcom will do in the future, but from the press release and simple economic law i can infer what they should do. Krabbus just wants the world to be a perfect utopia where everyone is equal.

I'm wondering if have read any of my posts at all, the only thing I'm saying is that every single player should play under the same set of rules if we are going to be in the same world, that's my point, nothing else...

I don't want anything for free, I'm paying for this game and have bought the serial key... I don't know if I'm going to buy Shadowland, but if I do I want everyone to have the same set of rules.

What would you think if someone did something wrong and didn't get busted, but you did when doing the exactly the same thing. Don't you think everyone should be treated in the same way? We can't have different rules for each single person on earth, you know!!!


I know one thing for sure, a fundamental change in the rules will unbalance the game - and Funcom will not go in that direction, they are trying every patch to balance the game as much they can.

I think it's worth buying the Expansion Pack for it's content even when we have the same set of rules. If the change of rules makes the Expansion Pack for you Thugdoom, then I'm wondering what kind of person you are in real life, a dominating childish teenager perhaps?

[__________Planetstar]

btw....if they don't implement the items to the players & my senario holds true....how many people that won't be getting the expansion will leave+how much net loss will that create=Funcom trying to balance the budget with much less cash & all other future expansions will be null & void.
The way of business=one person tells 10 others...each of those 10 others tell 10 more, etc....keep the customers you have happy & you will see more

any capitalist should know that....

It's not always about the money, it just sounds that way...

[__________Planetstar]

& btw again....your reply to me was wrong...if you own a business best of luck to you cause you gonna be filing chapter 11 in no time flat with the feds

[BoomDoom]

Originally posted by Krabbus
I'm wondering if have read any of my posts at all, the only thing I'm saying is that every single player should play under the same set of rules if we are going to be in the same world, that's my point, nothing else...

becuase you understand nothing about how anything works, Yes, i am aware

I don't want anything for free, I'm paying for this game and have bought the serial key... I don't know if I'm going to buy Shadowland, but if I do I want everyone to have the same set of rules.

You want nothing for free, execpt the skill specializations, weapons, and armor offered in the expansion pack

What would you think if someone did something wrong and didn't get busted, but you did when doing the exactly the same thing. Don't you think everyone should be treated in the same way? We can't have different rules for each single person on earth, you know!!!

Are you equating buying the expansion pack with a committing a crime? And yes, we do have lots of different rules on earth. You see, there are these things, they're called countries. And these countries have laws. And these laws are different from country to country


I know one thing for sure, a fundamental change in the rules will unbalance the game - and Funcom will not go in that direction, they are trying every patch to balance the game as much they can.

One thing I know for sure, never think for a moment any of us has any idea what the folks at funcom are gonna do. Just when you think they're on the right track they run off in a completely different direction

I think it's worth buying the Expansion Pack for it's content even when we have the same set of rules. If the change of rules makes the Expansion Pack for you Thugdoom, then I'm wondering what kind of person you are in real life, a dominating childish teenager perhaps?

Listen, its been made clear by a lot of people that there are some things they want in the pack and some things they don't want. The only way to market the pack is to put things that everyone wants in it. Of of those things is new abilities. New abilities are kewl, they're fun and its nice to be able to do different things. After a year of the game not changing much it will be nice to have some really new material. Oh, and I'm sorry i'm not a deluded little euro sophisticant that thinks the world is one happy utopia.

[BoomDoom]

Originally posted by Planetstar
btw....if they don't implement the items to the players & my senario holds true....how many people that won't be getting the expansion will leave+how much net loss will that create=Funcom trying to balance the budget with much less cash & all other future expansions will be null & void.
The way of business=one person tells 10 others...each of those 10 others tell 10 more, etc....keep the customers you have happy & you will see more

any capitalist should know that....

It's not always about the money, it just sounds that way...

Anyone should know that in order to sell a product there must be demand for it, so you put as much stuff in it as possible and make sure it is exclusive to that product. How many people do you really think will quit because of the expansion? More or less then the number that join? I'm betting less, and I'm also betting alot of the original players that quit will consider coming back, like i did.

IF its not about money what is it about? Respect? Fairness? Being Nice? Nonsense.

[BoomDoom]

Originally posted by Planetstar
& btw again....your reply to me was wrong...if you own a business best of luck to you cause you gonna be filing chapter 11 in no time flat with the feds

So you think that the ideal market condition is to have no exclusive innovation and to generate the least amount of demand possible?

Brilliant! I like it.

[__________Planetstar]

Thugdoom, you appear to misunderstand sarcasm too...

of course it's always about the money moron....

geesh...go back to college cause you obviously don't understand the world around you

over & out.....

[__________Planetstar]

who is that guy Bill Gates?

monopolies are illegal....unless you produce our defense system....microsoft

[Krabbus]

...are u heading for 1k posts???

You say that different countries have different set of rules, ok, but in AO will there be different set of rules even when both are omni's - is that right?

Will Funcom ever see this Thread, it's over 3000 views by now...