A Way to Find Loot outside Missions; Outdoors Hunting; Dyna-camp Ideas etc

[Londino]

the simple genius about mort, was that if it wasnt risky, it wasnt worth being there, IMO anyway.
if there were so many people that i was never in any danger at all then the xp would be 3k or so a pop, the same as avalon borgs, in which case i left, as did many other people. However, when mort borgs was good, it was exciting, dangerous & very rewarding xp wise. i remember quite literally hiding behind voorg whilst he shouted at the lvl 70 n00bs (myself) to stop leeching xp off him, but then someone makes a bad pull & then there are bodies everywhere (not deliberate bad pull if i remember).

more places like mort would be brilliant, but perhaps not 500k xp that would be a little OTT lol

[____________TKFieldy]

At lvl 89 I'm also wondering if I'm sentenced to indoor fighting within missions..........sure they are great xp, but it gets pretty boring after a while.

I say get us some new mobs in the outside areas.....have yalm, will travel

[Talanie]

Bigass bUmPaGe for higher hunting spots!

[NiGHTS]

I just hit 83 and must say its hard to find groups. 8x8 is mega camped and team missions are boring. I remember lvl40-65 were the best lvls. Right when I logged on there'd be a "NW GROUP NEEDS 2 MORE" or "VB GROUP NEEDS 1" all the time. Now I don't really group anymore. Team missions are the only source of exp too, and those are too hard without a doc. I say OUTDOOR HUNTING AND DUNGEONS ARE NEEDED. I like the idea of this thread, thanks hexxor.

[Blackwing]

let the players control the speed of their leveling, if you focus only on the threadmill they will soon leave.

root based professions like the fixer and the unchanged agent also are much much more usefull outdoors where you have the option of falling back out of mob range - the only place where roots and snares are a viable means of crowd control IS outside.

what i am against is to make loot in any way level restricted that is so AC (hey all we added some new super item only level 25 and lower can get, be prepared to kill one of your toons to experience the mission or pay outrageous prices for it - nah thx!!)

what - in retrospect - i LOVED about AC quests has been mentioned before: the personal timer coupled with FAST respawns (we are talking at the max 20 minutes).

this handy little item made it possible that items where NOT camped to death a few months after their introduction.

just my 2 credits.



Adan "Critical" Dilox,
Assistant Manager of Council Affairs.

[____________Keaorata]

Wohoo!
Just wanna add my support of this.

Its a fantastic idea! ... Im the sort of person who dies of boredom as soon as i walk in the front door of a mission. I *love* hunting outdoors.

As long as its comparable to doing missions - so there will be a 50-50 split of people doing both. We dont suddenly want everyone to stop doing missions and start hunting. It needs to be even

The sooner this comes about, the better

[BGumble]

Improving outdoor hunting IMO is the most needed part of AO.

FC - although Lush and PM are good and pretty well thought out we still have the situation where for any level range you have basically one area to go to. If you make 100+ areas they will be mobbed out almost instantly. Basically, make more than one choice please - spread them out so that everything isnt clustered into 10 teams standing around an OP.

Also, there is no real variation within areas. Remembering back to places like NW Cave in Lush it didnt matter where you went within the area you got the same risk/reward (unless you stood on an LB spawn).

I would like to see the whole NW cave area much larger, the areas near the OPs giving a certain amount of XP for each type of Mob but without too many risks (external attacks, wandering nasties). If you ventured farther from the OPs you'd still be killing the same basic types for Mobs (e.g. shades/eyes/bios/claws etc) but not only would you get significantly more XP from them you'd also get a much higher chance of LBs, Wolves, whatever wandering by and killing you.

The approach at PM is different - everything is clustered into spawn points.... that works OK but why arent the unused areas around the OPs filled with wandering mobs of a similar type - like it is in Lush. Basically the OPs should spawn so fast that fighting in them is impossible and pulling from them is a mighty big challenge but the further you move away so the density of mobs decreases and you have more chance.

[Darkbane]

Here is a list of xp-gaining/loot-gaining methods that should exist (some do, some don't yet) and how they should work (some do work this way, some don't).

Dynamic Missions (Solo & Team) - Dynamic layout indoor playfields with random loot, no respawn and maximum of 1 team. Gained from mission terminals.

Static Dungeons - These are simply fixed layout indoor playfields with random loot, respawns and no player limits. Simply find and walk in.

Static Mission - This is a fixed layout indoor playfield with random loot, semi-random loot and fixed loot, no respawns and maximum of 1 team. Gained from NPCs in some way.

Static Quests - This is a static mission, but it takes place over a variety of areas. Gained from an NPC, it will generally involve giving that NPC an item that has to be found/built. The NPC should always be available, and some method to prevent a PC repeating such a quest should exist. Fixed reward. This may not involve killing MOBs, it could require talking to NPCs, using different skills (or finding someone to use a skill for you), etc.

Hunting - This is simply the killing of MOBs in an outdoor area. The MOBs can be fixed spawns, random spawns, semi-random spawns or dynamic spawns (adjust level up or down to match kill rate of MOBs in area). Random loot.

Outpost - A 'capture-the-flag' type of PvP area. A side (clan/omni OR neutral) holding an outpost has access to its facilities which may include shops that sell unusual stuff, or stuff at slightly higher than normal QLs.

Thoughts on this list? Changes you'd make? Anything you'd add?

[Archerror]

The CTF idea of retaking an outpost would be cool.

I think that will be implemented in the next patch though (see patch info)

......

[georg]

By Cosmickall loot that is available from team boss MOBs will also be available at dyna camps.

Woohoo! That is a very good idea imo

[__________HardBoiled]

Dynocamps? How will we know about them? I suggest that they stay around till killed and then perhaps respawn somewhere else. They should also have an exp bonus for long live.

More outdoor spawns!
More outdoor loots!
Less outdoor agrro!
Less outdoor wandering mobs!

Say NO to non-drop items!

[Kuro]

My only concern with the dynacamp solution is this:

People want to hunt where they want to hunt. If dynacamps are spawning in PvP zones or areas that aren't easily reached, they'll complain. Personally though that's what I'd like to see. If they tend to spawn more in less travelled areas, people will tend to travel those areas more. That'll spread out the population more (good for frame rates) and possibly inspire more random PvP conflicts (instead of the current "It's really just an outdoor arena so I only accept challenges" mentality).

[Bionitrous]

Here's my usual overly long musings on DynaCamps. Think of them as the outdoor equivalent of the Boss Room in Team Missions. Or alternatively, a stab at solving the piss poor implementation of unique MOB's like Zuwadza and Nugget.

One of the game designers for AO (Gaute, I think) mentioned the idea of Dynacamps. Kinda like the Orc Camps that popped up on the scenery in UO complete with Shaman, Boss, and Grunts (and the associated treasure chests, of course).

Now, I'm perusing the development of other online games out there and come upon a snippet from a dev chat today for a game I'll keep unnamed. I hid the dev's name and Kawas and Dirtpeople were really something else but that would give away what game this is and I don't want to advertise for them in this post:

===========================================
Blackbriar: Could you give an example of "Point of Interest"?

DEV: Okay, well first a point of interest is a dynamically created "scene" that you can run across
DEV: more or less at random.
DEV: As an example, on Booine you might run across a sand crawler with Kawas loitering around outside.
DEV: As you approach the Kawas, they're suddenly attacked by Dirtpeople.
DEV: And maybe you can save the Kawas and get a reward from them, or let the Dirtpeople kill them,
DEV: or kill everything yourself...

============================================

Now, imagine all that vast empty space on Rubi'Ka. We know that Mort is chock full of interesting minerals and Perp Wastelands might be a prime spot for a Notum vein.

So you are cruising to a mission in PW in you Yalm and see a mining Transport broken down and some Omni employees trying to fix the left tread. The 'Transport' can be a MOB with hitpoints and everything and may be something you either 'save' or 'destroy' depending on your alignment or mood. The game can 'dyna-spawn' this little camp there in anticipation of you arriving based on your trajectory through the zone and the fact that there are no players in visual distance to see the Transport 'pop' into view. This provides a very natural aspect to this 'spawn'.

Now as you approach the 40 meters 'zone of influence' of the 'Transport' MOB you see a bunch of Mantises with a nice boss Mantis running toward the broken down Transport and the miners.

Do you:

- Destroy the transport, get a bunch of minerals, and leave the miners to the mercy of the Mantises?
- 'Fix' the transport with Mechanical Engineering and send it and teh miners on their way and possibly fight the Mantises for spite and loot?
- Kill the Mantises to defend the Transport and leave them on their own or call an Engineer from your guild.
- Kill and destroy everything for fun?
- Pass it by because they are too tough?
- Call you guild because they are too tough?

I give you another example. Let's assume war is declared eventually.

You are flying along the Stret River and come across a group of NPC Omni-AF fighting a group of Clan Sentinal Guerillas. What the server did was 'decide' it was time for a dynaspawn and noted that you were heading in a particular direction. It 'primed' the area with the Omni and Clan MOB's and waited for you to get into visual range. At this point, the 'scene' is triggered and the MOB's start fighting. Everything is natural to you as you only see the NPC's as you get into range and it appears they may have been fighting for quite some time.

You can fight for one side, heal one side, set your robot on those you hate, offer buffs to one side (or both for fun). If you are Clan and you defeat the Omni's then you talk to the OIC of the detachment and get a reward. After this, they evac out of sight.

This same scenario could be 'dyna-spawned' at random locations all over the vast planet. All the game engine would need to do is anticipate when someone might be coming into range and prep the NPC's.


I didn't think much of Gaute's idea of 'Dyna-camps' until I heard it described as in the above paraphrased Dev Chat for that 'other game'. I think that the quick addition of something like this could add some life to zones such as TLR and PW where happening across something 'interesting' (as opposed to a crashed spaceship you can't even enter) might spark some expansion of the playerbase.


I mention this in FunCom's defense as the AO dev mentioned this long before I saw this dev chat for this other game today.

[______________Lacaan]

yay! for outdoor stuff

[___________Graukonig]

I like the idea that Bionitrous brought up in the previous post. I'm not sure if it would be practical to have these events triggered by people though. Lets go back to the example of the omni transport under attack. How about if once it came under attack the guards in the omni outposts in the zone would shout that a transport is under attack and give the coords of the event. Also clan outposts in the area could be alerted to the attack so they could help the clans. As a reward people who helped their side would get tokens and/or items.

Another get addition, like the boss MOB in dyna camp that give bonuses to their underlings, would be officer type boss MOBs. Lets consider all the mutant camps in Lush Fields. Some of those camps are completely empty of players while the mines are oftern full. How about if after the empty camps spawn enough guys with no one attacking them they spawn a officer MOB. This MOB has the ability to "communicate" with other MOBs of its type in the zone. So lets say a officer MOB spawn and he "hears" that his buddies in the NW mines are under attack. He then rounds up the MOBs at his camp and marches to the aid of his fellow mutants in the NW mines. I think that this would make the zones far more interesting with the risk relief armies moving. Especially if the relief armies were big enough that all the groups in the NW mines needed to band togethers or get wiped out.

[__________HardBoiled]

To Graukonig:
That idea was partially implemented in EQ where at some trigger a high level mob was spawned and went to the area. That led to folks mindlessly killing the lower level mobs at the trigger location to try to make the high level mob spawn and kill it for loot.
Problem with that was that lower level folks were deprived from yet another valid hunting ground.
Also EQ tested that triggering formula only works for epic type of quest where everyone is at max or near max level and the triggered mob is uber tough.

[_____________Hextorr]

Excelent ideas...

The spawn of dyna-camps could be random in the zone and have the lvl of them mobs in the dyna camp adjusted to the lvl of mobs generaly found roaming in the emidiate area.

Could have something like:
PlayfiledMaxDynaCamp = 25
OnKillDynaCamp Respwan = 15 minutes
DynaCampTimeOut = 6 Hours

So you would have 25 dyna camps in a zone at any time, respwaning somewhere else in the zone 15 minutes after destroyed, or if noone found them for 6 hours (imagine it spwaned ina nasty area not many people pass by) it would respwan after that time somewhere else.

some could just be emcampemets of mobs other could be that great idea to have a small mob event going on, with mutants attacking a supply convoy or whatnot and you deciding what to do. On this case you could have the dyna camp check for player proximity and triger a mutant attack on the convoy when a player comes in range.

This could be made by having these spetial dyna-camps spwan a spetial "invisible mob" this mob would not attack but have extremely high perception checks, like 1000000 perception, this should detect everyone sneaing and non sneaking, then be auto aggro once it detects a player, but instead of having normal weapons his attack would be
1) Area of efect Nanoformula Summon Mutants
2) Target self damage 10000000 HP

This way when this spetial mob sees a player it "aggros" the player casting a area spell of summoning muttants and destroying itself. then the mutants wuld attack the convoy.

There would be diferent types of these spetial mobs spwan acording to the dyna camp they are in, for exemple they could summon omni tek troops to attack clan civilians if that was the dyna camp.

they will also need to assign families and hate lists to the mobs, same as OT vs Clan, For exemple Mantis Could Aggro any "Human" Npc, etc etc etc.

[_____________Hextorr]

Cosmik: Can you change the thread name to "A Way to Find Loot outside Missions; Outdoors Hunting; Dyna-camp Ideas etc" It will reflect better the kind of discussion and ideas we are having here

[___________Graukonig]

Response to Hard_Boiled:

I'm pretty sure that you were commenting on my idea for an officer MOB that would head a relief army, so I'm going to respond under the context of that idea.

I think that when I was playing EQ they did have something like what you were talking about. Or at least something similar. I can see the problem that such a system would have. For my idea there wouldn't be any unique items on the officer MOB, maybe better then average items but not a set unique item. What I'm trying to do with this idea is to create a more dynamic environment, one that automatically reacts to the players actions. The relief army, as I see it, would consist of normal MOBs that are already in the zone and thus they wouldn't have any special loot. So the only real gain for the players, besides a little more Xp from the extra MOBs, would be a more dynamic and interesting hunting experience. Personally I can think of nothing cooler, in the context of this game of course, than seeing an army of 50 or so mutants marching to the NW mines and the resulting battle between that army and the 30+ players that are usually at the mines ( the numbers may have changed, i haven't been there in a long time. ).

But anyway, the dyna camps will make an interesting addition for now.

[Londino]

bump, & a little idea of my own.

maybe this would take the 'dyna' out of dyna-camps, but how about making obscure places get spawned mobs for a day or two?
so you could have a spawn spot comparable to medusas or borg factory appearing somewhere in Rubi ka every few days, maybe 3 or so at any one time.
this way, people could have some fun hunting in dynamic, changing areas, but by the time the place became overcamped the spawn would die off & go elsewhere, & would need to be ofund again.