A call to arms!

[Littlerock]

Aimstraight enters the Cup, pulls up a chair and climbs up on it. She cleares her voice, and with a deep breath she shouts:

"My dear friends! How long can we tolerate that there are Omni-Tek personell in our midst? How long, I say, can we tolerate the oppressors to maintain bases in Old Athen, West Athen and Tir? I myself have done my best to rid our fine cities of the scores that tries to undermine our freedom!" Looking around, she notices that all are watching her now, and continues: "I've spoken to Commander Brock outside Tir, as I know others have too, and he told me that we should fight the Omni whenever we can, not only those that try to steal our bases, but also, and maybe even as important, those that tries to steal our cities from within. It's about time we show them that we really want our freedom!!" She stops and looks back at the people around her, hoping for some kind of support...

[Dabblez]

Originally posted by Agna
Aimstraight enters the Cup, pulls up a chair and climbs up on it. She cleares her voice, and with a deep breath she shouts:

"My dear friends! How long can we tolerate that there are Omni-Tek personell in our midst?

Hey! We are people too you know! And it's not like Clanners, despite the risks, don't come visit Rompa on a pretty regular basis. Maybe some of you Northerners don't mind us Southerners that much after all?

How long, I say, can we tolerate the oppressors to maintain bases in Old Athen, West Athen and Tir?

Kinda of cuts both ways though. You would not believe how many 'secret' clan bases, labratories and assorted hideouts can be found in Rome and Omni 1. Pot, kettle, black anyone?

I myself have done my best to rid our fine cities of the scores that tries to undermine our freedom! I've spoken to Commander Brock outside Tir, as I know others have too, and he told me that we should fight the Omni whenever we can, not only those that try to steal our bases, but also, and maybe even as important, those that tries to steal our cities from within.

For the record, Athen was an Omni city to start with, so let's not talk about stealing cities. You really don't want to go there.

It's about time we show them that we really want our freedom!!

I don't suppose you'd consider using non-violent means of protests like marches, hunger strikes and rallies? It worked for Ghandi against the British Empire and while you might think Omni-Tek are heartless bunch, the British Empire was no soft touch either.

No? Oh well, I tired.

Savoy

[Littlerock]

"Well, I guess I shouldn't be supprised to see a few Omni here in the Cup, and I will try to reply to your statements in quite an orderly fashion." Aimstraight steps down from her chair, and uses it as it was designed for. "But first, I need a little drink after having shouted so loud." she signals to the atrox behind the bar, and a few moments later she get a shot of scotch.

"You know, I didn't even talk with Omni before. I just cursed at them under my breath and went another way if I didn't end up in a fight. I think seeing your pa get shot does that to you. Anyway, yesterday changed this a bit, and I'm now ready to accept that some, and only some, Omni might be both human and humane. One or two might even be friendly." she sighs and empties her shot. As she reaches into her pocket for change for a new drink, a little calling card falls out. "Betji" it say. Aim hurriedly pick it up again, and looks around. "Some are quite interesting in fact."

"Well, back to your input. There is no reason to discuss who is the oppressor and who is the oppressee, as I think we both have our thoughts on that matter. As to secret clan bases in Omni areas, well... You got bases here, we got bases there. If we start shooting your bases up, I guess we either have a situation where you shoot our bases, or we have to dig in deeper." she smiles, her lips are thin from the effort of smiling to the enemy.

"The history of Athen... well, you know what? I don't care! Athen is a clan city now, and if you want it back you'll bleed for it! I know I will defend it to my last breath and a bit further." this time her smile is more a grin though and she show off her teeth in a predatory kind of way.

"And the last thing," she laughs scornfully "about marches? How long do you think we would be able to go before Omni-Pol or some other bunch of hooligans hoses us down? My estimate is within a yard or two from where we started the march. Because we would have to march near Omni HQ to be heard wouldn't we? A march in Tir doesn't really bug the high-and-migthy of the Omni I'm sure." she snickers, as another thought enters her head: "And to compare us with Ghandi, well... he did manage to go non-violent against the British Empire, but Omni-Tek is not as civilized, and doesn't have the same moral codex as the old Empire. Just look at who you're aligned with... Deamons and worse..." With that she stands up, and gives a mock salute.

[Vixentrox]

A couple years past, Boss Ross invited a group of Clan to make a peaceful protest through Omni-HQ. It was broadcast on planetwide comms that the protesters were not to be harmed. My step-sister was among those on that took part in the protest march. Little did she or anyone else realize that it was just a cunning ploy to teach those who had different views of Omni-tek a lesson. They were gunned down to the last.

[Necromancyr]

<<They were gunned down to the last.>>

*sigh*

Nothing warms the heart like a job well done!

[Littlerock]

Originally posted by Necromancyr
<<They were gunned down to the last.>>

*sigh*

Nothing warms the heart like a job well done!

And if this isn't the voice of an oppressor, then I have never heard one before...

[Dabblez]

Originally posted by Agna


And if this isn't the voice of an oppressor, then I have never heard one before...

Oppressor? Nah, just another psychopath. We've got them. You've got them. Heck, the neutrals got them. Some people have come to learn to enjoy the war and take great pride good they are killing people. I guess its their way of coping.


Savoy

[Dabblez]

Originally posted by Agna

"And the last thing," she laughs scornfully "about marches? How long do you think we would be able to go before Omni-Pol or some other bunch of hooligans hoses us down? My estimate is within a yard or two from where we started the march. Because we would have to march near Omni HQ to be heard wouldn't we?

You are not looking at the big picture. This conflict does not exist in a vacuum, its the ICC you want to impress, its the billions and billions of consumers of Omni-Tek products around the galaxy, its the other mega-corporations who think they can take advantage of Omni-Tek embarassment you want to reach. And above all it regular Joe-Omni employee you want you message to get through to. Not the powerful manager, just ther regular OT employess, people with familiy's and job who at moment just see the Clans as aggressors intent on destroying their way of life.

And yes, one peace march won't solve anything. I never said it would be easy and future protests may end in tragedy, as Vix described. That is where the true test of character and will comes into things. Persistance through adversity and intergrity are what saw Gandhi through some very dark times. Grabbing a gun and venting you frustration on a few OT employees who are just doing thier job is the easy way out.

Savoy

[Necromancyr]

<<Oppressor? Nah, just another psychopath.>>

I am hurt! Psychopath is such an ugly term.

Additionally, it is not as if any of that misguided rabble was permenently extinguished, they merely reaped the benefit of their misguided ways. And had a free trip to reclaim, which is still generously provided to the clanners, despite all of their criminal conduct.

While I would agree that turning the demonstrators into a shooting was in..... poor taste, it did convey the proper message in a direct fashion.

As to Omni-Tech being an oppressor, if that was the case, there would be no clans, no reclaim insurance for clanners, nor proper housing for them.

And yet, these misguided grubby thugs still label us as oppressors. Despite their coddling of terroists! Despite their own Sentinels gunning down innocent neutral citizens on a whim!

Pot! Meet Kettle! Black shall you be called!

[Ceane]

Edit: ops "mt" :P I was doing a little with my Signature and i clicked Submit Reply :P

[Astera]

Oppressor. The gunning down of Neutrals. Terrorism. Psychopath. One employee with the company whom so openly offers her opinions of how we should deal with them. You preach peace and non-violent protest, yet, you build instruments of war. Your fasts and candle-light vigils are for neutrals and those of the corporation. I'm sorry that we took your city, but it sent a clear and resounding message. Very few protests ever ended in any governmental institution seeing the err of their ways. Please keep referring to Ghandi, by all means. Then please point out at least 5 other instances where vigils were held in quiet desperation and things changed. I ask you, the candle light vigil that was held in honor of this downed pilot...how did that ever turn out?

*laughs*

Oh wait...Omni Tek raided OA, didn't they...oh my, and it was BEFORE the vigil!

...and there, laying on the ground broken and bloody, is this "Peace" that this opinionated Omni Employee preaches.


The ancient Americans did not win their independence through protests and/or vigils, they won it through War. World War 1 and World War II were aptly named...It wasn't World Protest I and World Fast II. Should we appeal to the consumer? Maybe...but as we all know, if it doesn't directly affect you and you are safe at home watching it on your gridfeed, it rarely becomes anything more than forgotten news. Its obvious that the consumer generally doesn't care about the families that were brutalized in the name of notum, or the countless deaths because of this resource. The Clans cannot look for help from any other colony, we have to do it ourselves.

So Savoy, builder of ONLY peaceful robots, continue your defense and tell us how to fight you. I will tell you that it has little effect on this clanner, who sees only the larger picture.

[Dabblez]

((I know it gets confusing with only one Avatar on the forum, but Dabblez is the one who builds robots. Savoy is politically minded one. They are two different characters, two different outlooks on life. They don't even know each other! ))

Astera,

You are right, there are not many instances of non-violent protest winning the day. There are some examples in the of women's right to vote and the American Civil Rights movements, but they are rare. The reason they are rare is non-violent resistance is much harder and takes a lot more courage then fighting back does.

As the raid on Athen was not an attempted invasion. It was meant as a commando mission to rescue our pilot. The fact that it ended up in street fighting is unfortunate. Had the situation been reversed, would you have not done the same?

As for the American War of Independence, you seem to assume it was a good and just war, but was it really? I can see why the 13 colonies felt the need for self-rule, its a natural evolutionary process. But was war really necessary? Would this not have come in time, as with many other former British colonies, without bloodshed, without families being torn apart and frightened loyalists having to flee to Canada? Could it be that the Father of the Nation might have been just a little too restless, a little to eager and trigger happy?

What was their hurry? The Colonies were not suffering any hardships under British rule. They considered themselves British, their standard of living was higher than in England, taxation lower. By the standards of the age, they had everything going for them. There was nothing that terrible going in the Americas to be worth the lives lost. I mean, look at the people in Canada, where they under any sort of duress from Britain?

Now let's look at what happened afterward the independence.

Slavery was to remain legal in the US, though it was not in Britain. It was going to take another very bloody war less than 100 years later see the end of that scourge. Independence war certainly did not benefit the Blacks.

The young American nation would in no time act as much a empire builders as the British, seeking to expand their territory and for that reason going to war with Spain, Mexico and Canada.

And let's not forget the plight of the Native Americans, who in the 100 years since independence lost all their land and were just about wiped out.

So whose freedom, who's "pursuit of happiness" was the American War of Independence really fought for? In light of all the many misdeeds that followed Independence, what was possibly gained by that war that can justify the violence and suffering it caused?

The same lessons apply to Rubi-Ka. Life is good among the Clans at thee moment. You can see the signs of wealth everywhere among the Clans, Camelot Castle, Versailles Palace, the multi-billion mining operations, the lavish parties and exciting West Athen night life.

Meantime as you all know Omni-Tek's lease coming to an end. Your hated foe is not going to be here that much longer. Why not let Omni-Tek be? Why not let these last few decades of cohabitation on Rubi-Ka between Omni and the Clans pass in relative peace?

Savoy

[Astera]

((oops...I told you I saw the whole picture savoy/dabblez... :P ))

Hmmm...where to begin?

Quote: As the raid on Athen was not an attempted invasion. It was meant as a commando mission to rescue our pilot. The fact that it ended up in street fighting is unfortunate. Had the situation been reversed, would you have not done the same?


Ever the politician aren't you?

Of course the Clans would have launched an operation, but it would have been open and not hidden behind words intended to make the listener think of a small operation...ie "commando mission". How your "little" operation would NOT have ended up as street fighting is beyond me...I suppose forethought is a lacking quality amongst our friends and enemies at Omni-Tek. The pilot, as far as I know, has been questioned and a little patience would have seen his negotiations for release beginning soon.

__________________________________________

Quote: As for the American War of Independence, you seem to assume it was a good and just war, but was it really? I can see why the 13 colonies felt the need for self-rule, its a natural evolutionary process. But was war really necessary? Would this not have come in time, as with many other former British colonies, without bloodshed, without families being torn apart and frightened loyalists having to flee to Canada? Could it be that the Father of the Nation might have been just a little too restless, a little to eager and trigger happy


If you cant see it now, I cannot expect you to see it then either, now can I? The things you spoke of after the above statement are intentionally designed to cast a further negative light on post revolution America while subtly making a connection to eventual post revolution Clanners, but in actuality have nothing to do with the WAR ( which happens to be the topic). We are not talking about slavery here, Savoy...we are talking about the WAR bringing about change. Were we being trigger-happy, (again, more negative nonsense) when we took control of our lives and revolted? ...or were we oppressed into it? Can the Clans govern themselves? Likely, given a bit of a rough start, but we will find the way.
___________________________________________

Quote: Life is good among the Clans at thee moment. You can see the signs of wealth everywhere among the Clans, Camelot Castle, Versailles Palace, the multi-billion mining operations, the lavish parties and exciting West Athen night life.


*laughing* After hearing this, I honestly have to stop and wonder if we live on the same planet. Remember the WAR we were talking about? Why is it then, do we have what we do? I will assure you that it was not through candle-light vigils and fasting! I'll say it again...this WAR has brought us where we are today! Our REVOLT brought about this change.

__________________________________________

Quote: Meantime as you all know Omni-Tek's lease coming to an end. Your hated foe is not going to be here that much longer. Why not let Omni-Tek be? Why not let these last few decades of cohabitation on Rubi-Ka between Omni and the Clans pass in relative peace?


Im sure there are those of us who were so traumatized by this war, we have become less than friendly towards the corporation war or not. Im sure that somewhere, quite a few would love nothing more than to exist peacefully...but, as you so honestly stated earlier, there are killers on both sides...
__________________________________________

*fades into the corner once more, sipping her drink quietly...listening*

[Littlerock]

Sitting a few chairs from the center of the discussion Aim nods to herself. "This is the way," she thinks as she swallows some more beer, "make people think, make them realize what's going on, and make them shout at the top of their lounges when they realize they're wronged. The true way of an agitator..." she leans forwards looking at the Omni-Tek lady.

"But, if you're so peaceful, and lovingly," she say, "howcome you've allied with the unredeemed?" She leans back, awaiting the answer...

[Dabblez]

Originally posted by Agna

"But, if you're so peaceful, and lovingly," she say, "howcome you've allied with the unredeemed?" She leans back, awaiting the answer...

Well first of all, I am not entirely sure there is an alliance between Omni-Tek and the unredeemed. If you could point me to any document or official statement on that regard I'd be grateful. As far as I know there is nothing to stop Omni personel taking the Redeemed side, or shunning the Xan all together.

Besides, what exactly is your problem with the unredeemed?

Is that they are ugly in form that makes you despise them?

Are you judging the whole race of unredeemed on one or two rotten apples you may have talked to or based on second hand reports and old wives' tales?

Is it that the unredeemed seek to harness the power of notum, much what both Omni-Tek and the Clans actively do on Rubi-Ka?

Savoy

[Marisha]

Marisha smiled at the young clanner boy who purchased the cup of coffee for her. “Thank you very much.” As she always did in these situations, she considered tacking “You Omni symp,” onto the end of her compliment, but after seeing the boy blush, she decided against it.

“I’m going to weigh in on this as well.” She looked briefly at Savoy and gave her a small nod before sitting beside her. “I’m not aligned to the Unredeemed. When the shadow lands were opened, the clans immediately rushed in and claimed kinship with everything cute and lovely. The Redeemed fit your pseudo-religious worldview of a righteous struggle, and you claimed them as your own.

“Now, keep in mind that the struggle between the Xan has been going on, by all accounts, for longer than any of us can imagine, and suddenly one side has a new allegiance. What were the Unredeemed to do? What would you do if suddenly Omni-Tek allied itself with a group that was in conflict with another? You’d reach out to their adversaries as well.”

Marisha paused for a moment to sip her coffee.

“I’m not aligned to the Unredeemed. I’m a sub-contractor. They need soldiers, I happen to be a soldier, they pay very well. Sure, one of them made me swear to never show mercy on the battlefield, but I wasn’t very much for showing mercy to those who are shooting at me. I sincerely doubt that there’s a redeemed priest somewhere making people swear to treat everyone kindly and seek peace, but I wouldn’t be surprised to find one urging clanners to fight till the unredeemed are an unpleasant memory.”

Marisha looked around for a second, and then added, “Oh, and why am I here at the Cup? The Maidens executives have meetings here sometime, where we plot the direction of our organization and our efforts against the clans in the current struggle. No, really, we do.”

[kaghelion]

How you know about an alliance between OT and the unredeemed?
Surely you're not trying to tell me that it's a coincidence that clanners are prevented from entering the unredeemed gardens and omnis are prevented from entering redeemed gardens. There are other indicators too.
Any omnis taking the redeemed side have it extremely hard in shadowlands so I'd say there is something to "encourage" them to take the "right" side.
If OmniTek were any closer linked to the unredeemed Philip Ross would be wearing horns... (Actually there are some that say he already does. )

(Just the fact that the unredeemed favours OmniTek should be a reason for any intelligent person to seek employment elsewhere. )

If Omni Corporations want to rent offices in Old Athen then let them. Of course they'd have to get a valid lease from the proper authorities, CoT. Until they do I'm afraid they'll be seen as intruders.
We're forced to keep our guard up since Omni-Tek decided not to keep their end of the Tir agreement. Just beacuse the old CoT left town doesn't meen that the the thousands clan citizens have any intention of leaving.
Intruders will be met by force. It's nothing personal, I'm sure most Omni's doesn't come there to enslave the free clanners there, but we just can't take any chances.


Oh, let me take this opportunity to firmly put a stop to any rumours that The Mockers would have bases within Omni Territory. We conduct our business at our end of the pond and everything would go so much smoother if the omnis kept to their business.

- Kaghelion, enterprising businessman since Mars 29476.

[Dabblez]

Astera,

The original post was a rallying call for the Clans to renew their efforts against Omni-Tek. My reply can effectively be summed up as (1) is this really necessary at this particular point in Rubk-Ka's history and (2) does this need to take form of violent insurrection or are there other means at your disposal? Call me a politician, propagandist or apoligist if you like, I think these are valid questions regardless.

I am not quite sure what your point is about the OA raid anymore. If you agree that the Clans would have attempted a rescue mission had the situation been reversed then our differences are not over a matter of principle, just tactics.

And no, the vigil has not secured Christian Furuseth release (yet), but it has ensured the issue remains on the agenda. He is not forgotten, as this conversation goes to prove. But perhaps even more importantly, his family knows he is not forgotten.

I don't really want to get too deeply sidetracked over the analysis of the American War of Independence. I find it interesting in that it is often quoted as a war that was both obviously just and necessary, but it if you look at how things developed in Canada, you have to wonder if a less bloody solution could not have been found. But maybe you are right, it is not all that relevant to the situation on Rubi-Ka.

[Necromancyr]

It never ceases to amuse me how these militant clanners continue to rattle sabers and bluster. Do you honestly think your posturing has any impact?

The cold hard truth is that your so called clans are a minor nuisance, nothing more. What little independance you have is due more to the interference of the ICC and Sol Banking corp than to your so called "freedom fighters".

Omni-Tech was fighting a major war with real opponents off-planets if you remember your history. You exsist only because several ICC members see you as leverage against Omni-Tech. If the full force of this corporation was brought against you, you will simply cease to be.

But, wars are expensive, and why destroy you? Indeed, you are much more valuable to us as consumers. Where indeed do all of your high tech goods come from? Reclaim Insurance? Medical goods? Shipping? Heavy manufacturing? Mining equipment?

Your precious clans are nothing more than parasites, who pay us for the privledge. So, by all means, continue your empty posturing and childish sabre rattling. As long as you pay your bills on time, we are content to let you have your tantrums.

In the mean time, you serve as a convienient outlet for undesirables, the unstable, and the dangerously radical. Not to mention, as a handy foil for our enemies. Let Sol Banking support you, let ICC interfere on your behalf. Supporting you has cost them dearly, and what has it gotten them? Nothing.

In the long run, you are an insigifigant threat. Your internal upheaval and constant state of anarchy demonstrate that amply. And in the unlikley event that you ever were to prove a threat, it is nothing a quick orbital strike could not correct.

You call us oppressors, and yet if that were true, you would have long since ceased to exsist.

Continue to delude yourselves.

[Astera]

*sighs*

I almost refuse to answer any of this...almost.

Quote: I am not quite sure what your point is about the OA raid anymore. If you agree that the Clans would have attempted a rescue mission had the situation been reversed then our differences are not over a matter of principle, just tactics.

The point is that you ask us to resort to protest. The point is that Omni Tek didnt resort to vigil instead of launching the minor "commando mission" into a Clan controlled city. Why should we then resort to protest? You obviously didn't. Do as I say, not as I do, and all that.

I am getting tired of this.

____________________________________

Quote: And no, the vigil has not secured Christian Furuseth release (yet), but it has ensured the issue remains on the agenda. He is not forgotten, as this conversation goes to prove. But perhaps even more importantly, his family knows he is not forgotten. I don't really want to get too deeply sidetracked over the analysis of the American War of Independence. I find it interesting in that it is often quoted as a war that was both obviously just and necessary, but it if you look at how things developed in Canada, you have to wonder if a less bloody solution could not have been found. But maybe you are right, it is not all that relevant to the situation on Rubi-Ka.


Thank you for realizing that it IS NOT relevant to anything in this discussion. I'll not waste any more of my time with nonsensical filler. As far as the concerns for the pilot...I will not pretend that I am even slightly informed on his condition...but as Cogs wrote, "He is being well cared for". We all know that Cogs is a man of honor, and I accept his word as truth. My condolences to his family, but please (and this is a hard lesson to learn) understand that this is a war. He risked his life the same as the rest of us do, every day.

*looks to Aim* Im sorry, please continue.

Thank you.

*smiles softly at Savoy with and gives a slight nod*

*sipping the rest of her water, setting the empty bottle on the table and slips quietly out of the bar*