Exploit Hunt = Witch Hunt?

[______________Profit]

Originally posted by ImaGideon
Guess what, you NTs and Engis and other Nano users can and often do "overequip" in a similar way.

How do you think NTs a bit over 100 cast their little nuke, or how do you think the engineers cast their slayer droids ?

Exactly by the same strong type of buffs like weapon users. You get your Meta +50 mastery, +90 infuse with knowledge or +140 mochams gift and engis often use mastery/infuse + wrangler to get their slayer pet.

That means nano users like engis can overequip the most of all players, wrangler+meta buff to get a pet that nearly can't be killed and never times out and makes them more powerful than any other player can ever dream of.

If you refuse to team up with a meta to refresh the nano buffs every 45miutes, then that is your problem, but don't say you can't overequip, or that you don't overequip, you do, just in another way than weapon users.

You would be right if the Program Classes didn't need an active skill check that gear users don't. However, the scenario you describe for progam classes is really all they want to see happen for gear classes. You want to use the uber gun? then have the program actively running.

simple. You just proved the opposite point my friend.

Profit

[_______________Flare]

my opinion on it is if your allowed to do it then its not an exploit.

[_______________Garzu]

Originally posted by cman
i especially like the whiners who call usin a skill wrangler to equip a weapon or something an "over equipping exploit"

LOL, agreed. I love to build my NT, and to do it, i use every legal means possible. Wranglers and other ability and skill buffs are there to be used. If you cant fight pvp becuse your equipment is to bad, go wrangle a bit yourself. Its fun!!

However, we do have a disadvantage when it comes to overequipping. I also like to add, from 800 MC - 1000 MC(max) we dont do more dmg pr minute. Maybe a slight difference of 500 dmg pr minute, but not more.

[Cosmik]

Originally posted by neohelios

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Our Funcom, who art in Sweden (?)
Hallowed by thy corporate charter.

Norway.

[____________Greystar]

Originally posted by Profit


You would be right if the Program Classes didn't need an active skill check that gear users don't. However, the scenario you describe for progam classes is really all they want to see happen for gear classes. You want to use the uber gun? then have the program actively running.

simple. You just proved the opposite point my friend.

Profit

The engineers pet stays until he logs off (or grids), after the buffs wore off, how does that prove your point ? Weapons at least deal less damage when the skill buff is gone, pets don't.

And we are talking about balance here, a NT is in PvM ways stronger than an earlier overequipped weapon user of the same level with a +90 nano skill buff. Those hold 45minutes, long enough to do a PvP session even. Why do you think NTs get aggroed like mad now that the hate list is fixed (of course the fact that the mobs rarely switch to other targets in the group now is not right either, so its not really fixed) ? Because they deal the most damage in groups. You want to deal more damage than the most damage, as you already do in groups ? How is that balanced ? That is just a try to trick Funcom into making you even stronger in PvM. Without a complete game revamp of all PvM/PvP aspects, you only destroy the already comparable weak weapon/melee classes completely with a nerf like that.

With the bandaid 40m range nerf, NTs got the shaft in PvP, everyone knows that, that needs to be changed to start rebalance things in PvP for them, but not what you say.

[Hamini]

bump

[______________Nelida]

wrangle ALL your nano skills by +132 making debufs meaningless and letting you cast nanos WAY beyond your level.
What's more that high level trader can dish out considerable damage between wrangles. (of course he'll be debuffing himself in the process but that's the price he pays)

Originally posted by KlngArthur



if u want to over equip badly make friends with an MP..at lvl 20 they can buff almost all nano skills for +25..

as for you neohelios....soldiers are suppose to do more damage provided all things being equal..not the soldier being able to use 100 ql better equipment then the doc..ie a soldier with ql 50 gun should beat the living crap out of a doc its own lvl in terms of dmg done...the soldier ALREADY has his adv..he doesnt then need another 100 lvl advantage over the doc..personally i think either weapons should check skills on use..or nano programs should be useable no matter what once they are uploaded...this is the only fair comparison..a solider might pay 100k for a wrangler ONCE...the nt or doc would have to pay an MP 20 k per a buff EVERY time they want to fight.

Also, many of you are forgetting trade skills..soldiers arent very good at trade skills...as a lvl 61 doc i can get my tradeskills buffed for 50 k and then make 400 k before they wear off, soldiers arent very good at trade skills, and thus the buffs wouldnt help them as much.

[______________Nelida]

I have a level 69 trader and I would stand NO chance soloing green mobs if I couldn't "over-equip". I use other Trader wrangles, general bufs, and my own deprive/ransack line to equip a 146 Vektor that is BARELY enough to get through two greens or the occasional yellow I find when taking medium setting missions. (i only have ql70 implants since I never took advantage of the treatment skill stacking AND I absolutely HATE shopping for clusters) Even then I have to chain cast, and maintain, a series of deprive/ransacks to keep my ATTACK number high enough to do decent damage. Without being buffed like this my damage is about 20% lower.

If I had to go back to a weapon of my own level (or only a few higher) I'd just have to quite playing my Trader...her killing power would be less than a green mobs healing. If you did this to ALL weapon using classes there would be nothing to play. Furthermore what would be the purpose in playing a Trader? Wrangle nanos would be pointless as NEARLY would deprive/ransack nanos...what other Trader nanos but Mez are worth a ****?

Originally posted by Profit
Say whatever you want abotu what FUncom meant or wanted...

Gaute has made it clear that overequipping was never meant to any great scale. This tells us two things.

One, that all pro over-equipping arguments are wrong. period. Sorry guys, simply doesn't matter what you think or beleive, Funcom did not want you to be able to do it. They said so. End of discussion.

Two, (and i do hope you read this far before you decide to tear me to flinders) the mechanics that exist in game you are absolutely right to ask teh 'what the hell did they expect us to do question'. The game mechanics are built to do exactly what they say they don't want done. You are absolutely right while being absolutely wrong. Is that not lovely?

This tells us that Funcom had no idea of how their game worked. nada. Either beta testers didn't tell them 'um..guys, your basic mechanics are entirely whacked' or Funcom just didn't really care or said, 'ya, whatever'.

You see, the worst part has been we players were attackign each others view based on what we could observe in game play, under assumption that there was a clear guideline. Well,
funcom has now stated their posture on the issue. And overequipping is bad and broken and has caused tehm to strengthen jsut about all adversaries in the game. And why is it this way? because they made it that way on purpose..yet, didn't want you to do it.

Stop attacking each other guys. The debate will rage forever because both sides are right. Focus your wrath on the guys responsible for it. Not each other.

Profit

[Hamini]

its not really over equiping that most of us are against....its the giant overequiping that some are doing thats my problem...for example a few days ago i pvped a lvl 16 wearing a decus armor coat...the lowest decus coat is 37....and his was obviously much higher, as it made my weapon hit for below minimum dmg...

Also, i wouldnt mind a trader equiping a lvl 110 vektor if a doc, for example, could then load complete heal at lvl 110 via MP/trader buffs.

[________________Ming]

ac works fine man...it takes off 1 point of dmg for every 10 points...if u are still hurting up your evades..dont ***** at FC about this..

Sure it works GREAT! That's why I hit enemies in PvP for 60 damage while they're hitting me for 1400. Works awesome, UNLESS you're a)trying to do damage to something with low damage fast weapons (i.e. ALL of my choices as an MA except the hammer which I didn't put IP's into because that's ludicrous for an MA) or b) you're getting hit by a hammer and die in 3 rounds because AC does jack **** to stop that kind of damage.

I will whine. You can't tell me not to, nor expect me not to. See the whine-o-meter (tm) post, whiners are the only people who get changes made (for better or worse.)

[______________Profit]

Originally posted by Zuleica

If I had to go back to a weapon of my own level (or only a few higher) I'd just have to quite playing my Trader...her killing power would be less than a green mobs healing. If you did this to ALL weapon using classes there would be nothing to play. Furthermore what would be the purpose in playing a Trader? Wrangle nanos would be pointless as NEARLY would deprive/ransack nanos...what other Trader nanos but Mez are worth a ****?

Wrangles and ransacks/deprive would be mroe needed as they would be _battle_ programs. I.e., need the trader with you in the field. Also, the bgigest fear many overgearers have is ransacks and deprives. Imaging having your 'ha..best gun on earth i ownz you' gun suddenly functioning about 10 classes lower because yuo just got skill ripped?

Everyone is still thinking statically and not dynamically. Funcom designed the buff system with dynamic thinking but coded it on statics mechanically. I.e., they wanted active shifting skills and stats to have meaning in a fight... however, they didn't write the game to back it up.

And your right. Sellign wrangles would be pointless. What a shame. Then gee, Funcom would have to get Tradeskills working so traders could like, make money, you know, like, trading? Like a Trader? Imagine that....(not a flame at you friend...just making a point to Funcom..again)

Profit

p.s. You are right abotu currently needing ot overgear..I had to do some myself as a trader. hated doing it but came down to survival. Making active skills means MOB's will need to be made far more reasonable. Been syaing that all along.

[Nanogater]

If game was changed to do skill check when using something then many balance problems would be avoided.

At the same time FC could reduce the hp/ac on mobs, they had to up it because low lvl players can wield high ql weapons, and use them after buffs run out.

Someone said in another thread something like:

To athletes competing, one on stereoids, the other not. Unfair everyone would agree. Solution = give stereoids to both...I think not.

For the original starting post in this thread, you'll know an exploit when you see one, so don't accuse someone for exploiting when they clearly are not. Mind you, killing mobs with area dmg NF's in front of other teams who already has engaged that mob is stealing xp. That is not exploiting, it is worse. And no one owns a respawn place, it is room for many teams at most places, all it takes is a little agreement on whom shall be hunting in what area. And off course, to go right into an area already occupied by a team or more and start killing is even worse than stealing, especially if your team is stronger than the ones already there. Not that anyone does these things off course

Nanogater