Man I really feel bad for you winXP users

[__________Maxtor 1-7]

Originally posted by Fion

I'm not some lunatic who thinks MS is out to get me or that the government is bent on world domination and doesn't care about the people it rules over lol.

Originally posted by Fion

These are not bugs they are INTENTIONAL devices in windows to spy on you and send that information back to MS. It is boarderline illegal!

uhhh, please decide between one, lunatic or concerned user?

So you believe that MS is just taking "extra precautions", thats fine with me, I just believe they have put those programs in to trace bugs.

[Xaielao]

lol. MS is NOT out to get me.. however it IS out to completely DOMINATE the market and force all computer users to use it's products. Dont believe me? Do some research on them and you will see I speek the truth.

[_______________Siksi]

Some of that is true (ie, media player, but I use Zoom player...), of course. But my compi is way more efficient since XP than ever... Oh yeah ! And the patches... man ? Have you any idea of how much I had to download with 98SE ? =) Not to mention what I had to download just to RUN a mac

[____________RedSonja]

I am afraid that you are totaly paranoid.
Not wishing to put too finer point on it, but if you want to be 100% secure and not have anybody being able to access information, please do the following things:

1. Switch off your PC
2. Remove the phone line from the back of your modem.
3. Remove any modem, be it analogue, cable or ADSL from your PC
4. Switch your PC back on in relative security.

Now that you have attempted to "scare" people into this WinXP should not be used stance, let me give you some truths.
Just as some background, I do not work for MS.
I am a Systems Administrator with approx. 9 years experience in that field.
I hold an MCSE qualification in the Win2k line of products, I also hold CNE qualifications in Novell.
At work I look after both Windows & Linux servers & workstations.

So let us look at your primary arguments here and see if we can get to the bottom of them.

Microsoft's primary goal is market share not money
The question here is really can you name me a company where this is not the long term goal?
Every company that has ever existed has the goal to be the biggest in their field, some are succesful where as others falter.
The fact that MS have been able to gain a high market share is based on a number of factors.
One of the main ones being that they have managed to market thier product in a way that makes 3rd party developers want to develop for it.
If they can show that their product is increasing in market share then more an more people will want to produce applications for Windows.
This isn't a bad thing, I do not really understand your argument here, if all companies just sat back and had no ambition to be the biggest in their market, well things would be very boring.

Microsoft want to dominate the market
This has really been answered above, however what you have failed to pick up on is that fact that they are dominant because their products are better.
IE 4 was released, Netscape could not compete, not because of this whole DOJ thing but becuase IE4 was superior in every way to Netscape.
Since the release of IE4 the browser way has been won, Netscape failed because they did not make their product better, they relied on having a big market share, which failed.
Windows runs on 90%+ of the worlds PC's because people know they can get an application to do anything that will run under that OS, they can purchase any game and it will work.

Microsoft are spying on you
Now here is an interesting argument.
You are giving the impression that vast MS servers spend all day doing nothing but collecting information from millions of Windows based PC's conected to the Internet.
Once they have all this information, who know what they will be able to do!
One of thie things MS is attempting to do with teh release of WinXP is cut down software piracy.
Software piracy is bad and those that steal software are no different from those than steal cars or mug old ladies, they are scum.
The PA features of WinXP are a very early test into the world of being able to "actively monitor" software piracy and attempt to shut down pirate OS's.
Let us just say for arguments sake that ever single MP3 you distribute has a "unique identifier" in.
So, you rip off some MP3, send them to all your friends, you don't deserve to be caught and punished?
You have actively stolen something and then passed it on to other people, if a unique ID enabled a prosecution to take place then nice one MS, the complains? Those with something to hide.
MS have got far better things to do then gather vast amounts of information about people's watching habbits.
They are not interested in people's personal details, why else do you think that PA is mandatory yet registration isn't?
So lets just say for example MS had a massive database, containg such information as "annonymous user in Italy has watched 19 kung-fu movies in the last month"
That information helps MS how exactly?

WinXP is buggy
Well that argument really aren't worth answering.
Every OS ever released has bugs in and every OS in the future will have them too.
Why?
Because they are programed by humans and humans make mistakes, if an OS was kept "in house" until every bug was found it would never see the light of day, by the time it was 100% ready it would be too old for release.
Did you know that every single typo or spelling mistake in an OS is assigned it's own bug number?
So, if a help file contains the word "teh" rather than "the" it is assigned a bug number, hence the high bug count the press loves to pick up on - press and web sites only giving half the story and it being an anti-MS one, that's novel, not.

Win98 is the best OS
Not worth trying to answer this one and certainly not one any professional needs to try and justify.
The fact is this is such a bad statement it makes my hair curl!
Win98 is built on top of the Win95 code which in turn has it's roots firmly based in DOS.
If is a hybrid 16/32bit OS that is prone to crashes, a single badly behaving application can take the whole OS down, as can badly written drivers.

It's just really upsetting to find that people are so paranoid and I suppose it just goes with the way the world is today.
Nobody takes things at face value and probably rightly so.
A lot of the features in Windows are not "listed on the box" but then again you're goverment doesn't broadcast the facts about what it gets up to when it's gatehring information about people.
If all this "spyware" results in jsut one prosecution for software or music theft then I think it has justified itself.
If MS suddenly empty your bank account one night then you've got every reason to complain.
If MS posts your name, address and telephone number on it's web site one day then again you've got every reason to complain and be angry.
But just because the best OS ever to leave Redmond might be attempting to stop piracy, sending information to MS with reference to erros or problems or even a list of mpg's you've played on your PC, I don't see why it should be branded the worst thing ever.

Don't forget to check under your bed at night, they are always watching you.

[_______________Siksi]

Originally posted by RedSonja
I am afraid that you are totaly paranoid.
Not wishing to put too finer point on it, but if you want to be 100% secure and not have anybody being able to access information, please do the following things:

1. Switch off your PC
2. Remove the phone line from the back of your modem.
3. Remove any modem, be it analogue, cable or ADSL from your PC
4. Switch your PC back on in relative security.


Don't forget to check under your bed at night, they are always watching you.

Man, you make me jumpy... ain't there something glowing in the dark, out there ? What was that noise ?
I promise you my dsl modem tried to kill me ! =)

Cheers

[Laeni]

Hey Red, why aren't you telling the U.S. government all your wonderful points about Microsoft. Why I bet the government would never have charged Microsoft with being a monopoly and using illegal tactics in order to dominate the market if they had just listen to you.

Seriously if I were REALLY paranoid I would simply consider you to be on Microsoft's payroll since you seem to be kissing up to them so much.

And just for the record, some of the most clueless people I have ever known were system administrators. Sorry sweetie but your title doesn't impress me at all.

[Xaielao]

<--- Agree's with Leani

[____________RedSonja]

LOL!!!
It bothers me not one little bit.

Some of the most clueless people in the word are Systems Administrators
Hummm, yer, that's right!!
We are all stupid, thats why we sit around all day earning loads of money, with the whole company we work for relying on us to keep things ticking over smoothly, to make sure we don't get hacked, oh the list is endless.
But no, you're right, we are no more intelligent than the "Do you want fries with that?" people.

Sorry sweetie but your title doesn't impress me at all
Wasn't trying to impress you, the point of listing some of the qualifications I have earnt was to show that I do know what I'm talking about and I'm not just going on some personal agenda rant (a la original post in this thread).
I don't need you to be impressed with my qualifications, I've got plenty of people who are, my bank manager likes my qualifications for example as it keeps money flowing in!

I enjoyed your typical response, typical in that as soon as anybody defends Microsoft then the answer has to be "You work for them".
Nope, it's just I have a brain, I have intelligence and rather than juimping onto bandwagons and doing some "fashionable MS bashing" I actually do the research myself and find out the truth rather than believing every single paranoid rant that gets posted.

Believe what you like, if you want to continue believing that MS are just out to find anything they can about you then go on believing it.
It's not up to me to attempt to change your mind, that is only something you can do.
All I can do is attempt to play down the many myths that exist, to actually tell you researched truth rather than letting you read some of the BS anti-MS material on the net.

I wonder how much of the anti-trust (only in America would they attempt to slap down a company because they were being successful) case notes you've actually read.
It makes an interesting read really, and shows that indeed the government doesn't exactly have a strong case against MS.
You are ware that nothing is going to happen to MS once this case is over right?

So, before I get back to the work I'm paid to do, please carry on with the MS bashing.
Type M$, Micro$oft or Micro$haft when ever you can (because that is really clever word play).
Continue to spout the opinions of somebody who hasn't done any research, becasue unfounded information is great.
The most important reason I want you to continue your posts is because it cheers me up during the day.
Without posts like this these kind of forums's would get so boring, all these people who don't work in the industry talking rubbish, it makes us all laugh.

Oh, no I don't want fries with that.

[Laeni]

Yeah you're not trying to impress anyone with your title. Right.

And your assumption that anyone who disagrees with you must be slapping burgers and dishing out fries says more about your personality than anything else. For someone who claims to be so well paid and so well respected you seem a tad insecure.

And I didn't say you worked for MS, I said that IF I was REALLY paranoid, THEN I would think you were on MS payroll. Do try to raise your reading comprehension dear, it makes life so much easier.

What MS motives are in collecting information, I still say they have NO DAMN BUSINESS having their O/S sending them info about me or what web sites I use for ANY REASON WHATSOEVER.

They want to stop software piracy? Tough! They still need to STAY THE HELL OUT OF MY COMPUTER. I don't steal software. They've got my money, they don't need anything else from me.

[____________RedSonja]

You have now mentioned my titles and qualifications twice, are you sure you aren't impressed?
I mean, if I'm not impressed with something I don't tend to go on and on about it.

I don't so much claim to be well paid, I am well paid, it goes with the job, IT Managers & Sys Admins are extremely well paid because by the flick of a switch we can either keep a company running or watch it fall.

Oh, by the way, calling me dear doesn't annoy me - if that was you intention (you've used that twice) I actually quite like it.

To stop piracy everybody needs to be checked, if you are above board it shouldn't bother you.
It's no difference from being randonly stopped by the police, sure it's an inconvenience, but because I know I've done nothing wrong, five minutes of my time doesn't really matter as it shows the enforcement agencies are actively trying to curb crime.

Lastly, once again, how are MS collecting information about you?
Nobody has to register their software, so they cannot tie anything to anybody, as all unregistered copies of Windows are anonymous the only information gained is "anonymous user in the US did so and so".

[____________Fpockets]

haha this is pretty funny.

btw i beleive there is life on other planets. there might be a planet full of systems administrators somewhere...........

[LLJKTonitrum]

Originally posted by RedSonja
Microsoft's primary goal is market share not money
The question here is really can you name me a company where this is not the long term goal?
Every company that has ever existed has the goal to be the biggest in their field, some are succesful where as others falter.
The fact that MS have been able to gain a high market share is based on a number of factors.
One of the main ones being that they have managed to market thier product in a way that makes 3rd party developers want to develop for it.
If they can show that their product is increasing in market share then more an more people will want to produce applications for Windows.
This isn't a bad thing, I do not really understand your argument here, if all companies just sat back and had no ambition to be the biggest in their market, well things would be very boring.

The point I was trying to make is that the vast majority of these accusations would do NOTHING for Microsoft's market share.

It'd be an expenditure of resources, for gains that would be minimal, if not nonexistent.

Not that Microsoft hasn't done some bad things, but rampant and unchecked spying isn't one I can imagine them doing.

[Laeni]

Forget it Red. If the concept of privacy is alien to you, there is no way I can get you to understand it. You are one of those people who is pefectly happy to give up a right because you "have nothing to hide".

When your identity gets stolen by some thief due to the security holes in your system, don't come whining to me.