"I know there are still concerns over the healing capabilities of the Doctor (which I'm investigating), but this change will help Doctors in the healing department"
I don't see how traders healing for less are helping doctors in the healing department. Nerfing traders wont make their heals better. They'll just make their heals the only thing avail.
The only department this is helping someone is the ego / griefing department. Isn't that obvious ?
I agree.Originally posted by Mercatura
You've got to be kidding me.
I hold the nerf monger docs half-reponsible for this crap. You don't hand a retarded kid a firecracker and a bic lighter, because you know he is going to do the worst possible thing with it. You don't rant and rave to FC about X being too powerful or whatever whine-of-the-week there is and expect them to come up with a decent change. Good god, look at their track record of game mechanics changes.
.
Sad thing is, I just reactivated myself >_<Originally posted by Maxwel
". I know there are still concerns over the healing capabilities of the Doctor (which I'm investigating), but this change will help Doctors in the healing department when comparing themselves to Traders, "
CZ
This is the attitude that ruined the game for agents and cause me and 12 of my friends to quit.
Out of all those people only me and one friend came back...
This attitude isn't unique to AO. It's present in every other online MMOG too, it's just that the Funcom folks seem particularly susceptible to it.
Not really true : Microsoft's Asheron's Call has a policy about never nerfing anything.Originally posted by Calenth
This attitude isn't unique to AO. It's present in every other online MMOG too
That means it takes them some time to balance content, but on the other end you don't wake up after patch day with a worthless character. That's worth it if you ask me.
Well, it's still present in the player-base. And I know that several items have been taken out of the game as too powerful and whatnot (I quit after spending 3 months gathering crystals or something for some armor quest, only to have the quest removed from the game in a patch.)Originally posted by Muetdhiver
Not really true : Microsoft's Asheron's Call has a policy about never nerfing anything.
That means it takes them some time to balance content, but on the other end you don't wake up after patch day with a worthless character. That's worth it if you ask me.
AC does has the best implemented quests that I'm aware of (I still think the silifi of the crimson stars quest should be the model for all other item quests in these games.) But AC's main problem is that it's so boring it hurts, and the graphics are bland as heck :P
But, yes, overall, the folks at Turbine definitely have a clue on balancing issues.
AC2 is in beta now isnt it? ;P
But really, this sucks, ive been playing for 3 days or less, and blam I have to make a new character... JOY OF JOYS :|
"Well, it's still present in the player-base. And I know that several items have been taken out of the game as too powerful and whatnot (I quit after spending 3 months gathering crystals or something for some armor quest, only to have the quest removed from the game in a patch.)"
The item you're talking about is the Greater Shadowhunter Armor, they realised it was a mistake and put it back just the same sometime after ... nothing that qualifies as a nerf since.
It's a good start.. the dot length at 30 seconds seems fair too, don't like the idea of it being shortened.
"AC2 is in beta now isnt it? ;P"
Beta Starting in 18 days from now.
You know, this is so extreme, I almost wonder if it isn't a deliberate bait and switch tactic. So that when they propose the *real* change, people won't freak out about it.
Should've known Funcom would have taken the easy way out.
Where's your brain?
DoT was doing half damage. How about fixing that BUG? Nope, nerf.
There are so many ways you could have fixed this without making delayed health payment effectively worthless.
Do you know how hard it is to find a doc at high levels?
I agree this was overpowered, but you don't need to make it worthless in one big NERF.
Katelin Arinia Rhees
Level 220 Enforcer
Former Enforcer Professional
Former President of the late Midnight Reveries
Account Created: 2001-10-08; Account Expired: 2005-02-19
This goes back to a bit of advice someone gave me.. If you play the main tank or the main healer, you will never get nerfed as they are supposed to be 'uber' :P
WoW
ok lets back up here FC . Your answer to fixing the recharge on a docs nano is to nerf trader heals ? come on now . That is insane . Nerf trader heals if u want but it does not FIX the doctor profesion . It does NOT solve the problem of healing the idiots in our teams .
Why must every " balancing " action taken by Funcom mean a nerf of skills to a specific class ? Why can they not just FIX the recharge times ? As a doc alt thats all i want . I dont care how fast or how good a trader can friggin heal . All i care about is how fast i can heal people in my team . As it stands traders can heal faster then i can . So your answer to that is to nerf them . Come on now . Where is the balance in that ?
If you were smart ( and maybe u already did this ) you would gather and form a group of people that play each and every class . Ask them about THEIR issues and not what they think of other class's . Use their opinions and take full advantage of them . Implement the ideas ( to some degree or another ) and help make AO the way it should be .... Fun for Everyone .
This game is heading in the wrong direction . Lets stop it and get a grasp of what realy needs to be done and not temp solutions that anger other profesions . Bump if u agree .
Originally posted by Tink
*yawn*
You just don't know how the trader heal works and I suppose you don't want to know either I mean why let facts get in the way right?
You cannot look at a traders heal and just ignore what the requirements are for casting it.
Yes I can... and I am doing to. There is no explanation, requirements or otherwise that justify the fact that the raw numbers ar better than ours in both cast time, min/low avg, and max heal. Im a DOCTOR, a trader is a SHOPKEEPER.
Any good trader I know keeps his ransack plunder spaced out, so he might only have to cast it once. And you can eventually self cast the best one without ransack deprive with impys ( once again, no, dont care HOW you get the requirements, just that you can )Originally posted by Tink
Distributed Care the dotors second best heal of the second best range of healing nanos heals for 481-948 and uses 181 nano.
Premium Delayed Health Payment the traders best heal. This heals for 920-1,144 and uses 262 nano.
Now in the time it will take the trader to cast a heal after a plunder a doc can at least cast their team heal twice.
Okay, Ill use only single heals, but I dont want to hear you or ANYONE else b1tch when you die and I say you had a FULL hp bar on my screen, while you have dropped dead on yours. HP bars are bugged, and until they are fixed, team heal must be used.Originally posted by Tink
Doctor can heal 962-1896 in the same time a trader heals 920-1,144 and can do this using their second best heal on their second best healing range. Doctor casting twice would use 292 nano and the trader casting after the plunder uses 602 nano and I am sure the doctor has more nano to spare.
This is aside from the fact that the doctor should be using single heals not team heals. Lets put it this way if you are a doc who relies on team heals and not single heals then I do not want you on my team.
And yes, and good doc has more nano than a trader. I still dont care. And neither do the rest of the docs out there. The bottom line is the numbers speak for themsevles. There is NOTHING in your post to justifiy that the numbers traders have are better than a doc's. Can you justify it? I challange you to try.
Traders.... hit harder than soldiers, heal better than doctors. That says it all.
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ok, I'm going out on a limb and saying that nerfing was the best way to solve the problem. If they improved Docs heals anymore no one would ever die and can you imagine what it would do to PvP? The Doctor would truely be unkillable.
I do think however that the way they did the nerf was wrong. They should allow the Trader to cast their heal as much as they want, but have the DoTs that it generates stack with one another.
Right. But making the DoTs stack would have meant reprogramming the way the whole NCU deal works. So they arrived at this, easy, lazy, "solution."Originally posted by Crin
ok, I'm going out on a limb and saying that nerfing was the best way to solve the problem. If they improved Docs heals anymore no one would ever die and can you imagine what it would do to PvP? The Doctor would truely be unkillable.
I do think however that the way they did the nerf was wrong. They should allow the Trader to cast their heal as much as they want, but have the DoTs that it generates stack with one another.
Cosmik you obviously havent been paying too much attention to this thread as you seemed to have grasped totally the wrong end of the stick.
Despite many people pointing out that Doctors were still the most capable healers over time and that in a group without a doctor Trader healing is unreliable and risky due to the need to divest you've still managed to shoot off in totally the wong direction with little or no thought to how this affects an entire class and with absolutely NO consultation with the nerfed class. I see you are prepared to spend much time and effort talking to Agents and MAs about their problems, releasing sneak previews to their sites and answering questions from NTs yet when it comes to nerfing one for the core capabilities of a profession you suddenly dont have the inclination to discuss the issues with them?
Many people have suggested more sensible and equally implementable changes (if changes are required) but you seem to have totally dismissed them.
Frankly I'm disgusted that you havent been able to see through the nerf calling in this thread and realise how trivial the issue is and how much of it motivated by jealousy.
It seems your idea of monitoring is to read the headlines only, how totally unsurprising.
Here are some better suggestions for you Cosmik although having done your quota of monitoring and nerfing I doubt you'll be back to read them.
1. Decrease the variability of doctor heals
2. Increase the variability of trader heals
3. Increase the recharge time of trader heals
4. Increase the nano cost of trader heals
5. Decrease the nano cost of doc heals
6. Decrease the recharge time of doc heals
7. Make the DoTs stack
8. Make the healing team only
9. Increase the Bio Meta requirement for trader heals
10. Reduce the amount of divest stacking possible
11. Make Ransack/Divests lock BM for a few extra seconds
Any of the above would probably be better than what you've suggested.
The really sad and stupid thing is traders are not better at healing than doctors unless a doctor is present to allow them to spend the time to ransack up to casting heals 50-100 levels above them. Without a doctor they simply cant do that and heal at the same time, not reliably anyway. Take a bunch of doctors who have teamed with traders and seen "xyz healed you for 1000 pts" and you get a one sided and ill informed thread. Funcom you really need to take a few doctors and traders at various levels onto test, construct realistic teams and missions and actually compare the healing output in a real team situation, you'd find that other than at the highest level very little change is needed.
Disappointed and disgusted.
What an incredibly stupid thing to say. Lets extend you argument to weapons.... There is no explanation, requirements or otherwise that justifies your weapon producing the same damage QL for QL as other classes using the same weapon. After all, you are a DOCTOR, put down the shotgun and go back to the clinic. But you wouldnt like that would you, you'd rightly say that although the weapon looks as good on paper you dont have the skill buffs to do do the same damage all the time and that the occasional crits should be ignored. By your logic there is no justification for you weilding a weapon at all, ever.Originally posted by Turin
Yes I can... and I am doing to. There is no explanation, requirements or otherwise that justify the fact that the raw numbers ar better than ours in both cast time, min/low avg, and max heal. Im a DOCTOR, a trader is a SHOPKEEPER.
Turin, speak for your class, and let the Trader decide if they want to be shopkeepers or not.
Are you hot about having a flimsy scalpel as your only avail weapon ? Obviously not, because you want to enjoy your char. So do we.
Go post about what your class needs, leave alone the other classes.
Turin if your not going to consider how Traders step up to casting a better heal and how that affects the team healing output and only look at nano stats you might as well have never played. Thats right. You could have just looked at a website and gave us your authoritative conclusion.Yes I can... and I am doing to. There is no explanation, requirements or otherwise that justify the fact that the raw numbers ar better than ours in both cast time, min/low avg, and max heal. Im a DOCTOR, a trader is a SHOPKEEPER.
However, for those of us that try to really understand this dilemna we look at the problems in its entirety.
Btw, when I play my Doc I use single heals to great advantage. Teaming with any good Enforcer he'll keep aggro. You'll save mana and heal him more if you use single target. He loses aggro, team heal. Simple.
Don't bother to bring level into it, that tactic is valid at any level.
Vaporlok
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