Re: So FC?
I wouldnt mind one either,Originally posted by FuryFerret
Can we have an official statement on why you let a real small minority of the game destroy it for all the others?
And remember your very own Poll showed that few cared about PVP fixes.
http://forums.anarchy-online.com/sho...?threadid=2223
Less than 8% (7.3%) of those polled prioritize as important PVP
Even the Storyline ranks higher.
-Koyote
Last edited by Koyote; Mar 19th, 2002 at 04:55:31.
First... PvP will be dead after the OE-Patch in its actual form. After the OE-Patch (more then it is actual already true): See a Trader... run or die. What a cool PvP... wow. The only Prof with a chance against Traders are Pet Profs then.
Solution: Make Nano Resist working and/or lower time and amout of debuff significantly. (With maxed Nano Resist since 3 months and I countered 2 - two! - Nanos in this time. rofl)
Second... this IP Reset is just a joke on AO, isn't it? This removes a big aspect of RPG from the game. We all will end up with the same commonly accepted "ideal" Char per Prof. bah... And again, the whiners, not able to develop their chars wisely won. I would accept an IP Reset, if it comes only one time, to give players the chance to rework their Char after this many changes of the game rules FC has done. But as part of the game, this means only, that FC is preparing themselves for more chances of game rules... " Hey, you can reset your skills!"
Conclusion: OE - good idea, but will extremly over-power any Debuff-Prof in PvP. IPR simply a failure, not needed and will introduce some nice bugs.
PS: I lost yesterday almost all of my Armor and some Imps during a time warp, as I was swapping imps. "Sorry, can't help you." lol This will be funny to see, when all this people, who using the IPR loosing almost anything in such a case. - Its all part of the game.
Airri
One further comment: I understand you wanting to encourage teaming and therefore not wanting to restrict the overequipping of belts and NCUs (though it really is the path that most overly twinked characters take to overequipping). But have you considered how this decision will work in conjunction with the IP Reset. Everyone will be plowing their points from other skills into CompLit, equipping that 6 slot belt and NCU and then dumping themselves down to whatever they need to access the grid exits they tend to go toward.
Scorus
Team Skill Wrangle (Exceptional) debuffs the trader by -249 in all skills. By the time the trader can execute Team Skill Wrangle (Exceptional), the trader can buff himself at least +303 in skills by using Divest Skills and Plunder Skills before using the team skill wrangle. So it's entirely possible to buff your team +118 points and yourself +54.Originally posted by labrutte
18. Will all the Trader wrangles become useless?
NO. You will just have to keep them going...
It is so funny. In fact only those with a trader in their team will be able to keep the wrangle going. then the trader will have to use a so low ql weapon cause wrangler is buff for the team but debuff for him.
It will be so funny to use a shotgun ql 50 when i'm lvl 100 only to make the engin keeping is bot.
RK2
If trader chooses to further buff an individual while maintaining the team buff, the trader will slip into negative skills at that point. But speaking as a person that plays a trader, that's part of my job. So what if I have to use a lesser shotgun if my team is hitting harder than they normally could?
Scorus,Originally posted by Scorus
One further comment: I understand you wanting to encourage teaming and therefore not wanting to restrict the overequipping of belts and NCUs (though it really is the path that most overly twinked characters take to overequipping). But have you considered how this decision will work in conjunction with the IP Reset. Everyone will be plowing their points from other skills into CompLit, equipping that 6 slot belt and NCU and then dumping themselves down to whatever they need to access the grid exits they tend to go toward.
Scorus
Reread the article. IPR can only be done on a completely unequipped character... So, if you want to use it you'll need to remove belts, NCUs and implants. So it's unlikely that you'll see you fears come about.
I can't wait to see the bugs...
The only good thing about 14.2 is that it'll fix the lag problems.
I fought myself through the that monster discussion for at least half an hour, only to see that none of you has a real free mind here, If you like to pvp - than challenge someone that might offer a fair fight. So if you think Traders or whatever are to strong for you don't challenge him - or if they challenge you refuse. It is a RPG you can play your Character any way you want to.
To the monsters, if you cant fight them on their ground alone - maybe you are to low in lvl to do that, so seek another place to hunt and come back if you are stronger. If you can't make a mission on a certain lvl of difficulty - reduce it or team up with someone that is willing to help you. And so on...
Use your brains!!!!! Noone will make you absolete, noone will rob you of your fun... There are more options to do that what you want. Maybe the difficulty level rises, but that is the ****e of it - team up, join organizations, that can help you and so one. Again use your brains!
Airri, I am willing to bed you Havent been playing this game that long. I dont think you would have made such a comment if you had been playing since day 1.Originally posted by Airri
Second... this IP Reset is just a joke on AO, isn't it? This removes a big aspect of RPG from the game. We all will end up with the same commonly accepted "ideal" Char per Prof. bah... And again, the whiners, not able to develop their chars wisely won. I would accept an IP Reset, if it comes only one time, to give players the chance to rework their Char after this many changes of the game rules FC has done. But as part of the game, this means only, that FC is preparing themselves for more chances of game rules... " Hey, you can reset your skills!"
Airri
As I see it, it's Funcoms way of saying they are going to keep messing up the game mechanics for all the people who cry bout Traders ect that you are going to need to reset IP because your gonna be so screwed. This way they dont have to deal with it
-Koyote
Last edited by Koyote; Mar 18th, 2002 at 17:44:58.
On the topic of Nanoresist, I have a question: were they nanos from players or from mobs? And what kind of nanos were they? I have a su****ion that root/snare nanos have been intentionally made difficult to resist. Where as other type of nanos are more easily resisted. And has anyone actually gotten hit by a trader's divest/plunder combo in PvP? The whole thing may be moot.Originally posted by Airri
First... PvP will be dead after the OE-Patch in its actual form. After the OE-Patch (more then it is actual already true): See a Trader... run or die. What a cool PvP... wow. The only Prof with a chance against Traders are Pet Profs then.
Solution: Make Nano Resist working and/or lower time and amout of debuff significantly. (With maxed Nano Resist since 3 months and I countered 2 - two! - Nanos in this time. rofl)
I personally think the IP reset sucks. Those little flaws in my character are part of my character. And some of those flaws have helped me significantly (mostly round the lower levels, true). For example, when I though being a MA trader would be a good idea and poured IP into MA, Brawl, Dimach, and PhysInit. Then later after switching over to shotguns and running out of ammo. Or removing my shotgun when the fight is down to the wire and hitting with a Dimach. I almost wish I could sell IPR to other players. I won't be using them.Originally posted by Airri
Second... this IP Reset is just a joke on AO, isn't it? This removes a big aspect of RPG from the game. We all will end up with the same commonly accepted "ideal" Char per Prof. bah... And again, the whiners, not able to develop their chars wisely won. I would accept an IP Reset, if it comes only one time, to give players the chance to rework their Char after this many changes of the game rules FC has done. But as part of the game, this means only, that FC is preparing themselves for more chances of game rules... " Hey, you can reset your skills!"
Conclusion: OE - good idea, but will extremly over-power any Debuff-Prof in PvP. IPR simply a failure, not needed and will introduce some nice bugs.
PS: I lost yesterday almost all of my Armor and some Imps during a time warp, as I was swapping imps. "Sorry, can't help you." lol This will be funny to see, when all this people, who using the IPR loosing almost anything in such a case. - Its all part of the game.
Airri [/B]
If I've got to live with IPR then I wish there was a penalty to it. Such as using an IPR point returns 90% of the IP of that skill. That would make people really consider whether or not it's worth completely changing who their character is around
Rechecking Charms when debuffed is going too far! It is also inexplicable given the rules and situation they represent. As far as I know, it goes like this :
1) A charm is run as a hostile nano on the mob.
2) Should they not resist then they become subject to the effects of the nano. (in this case, under the contol of the charmer)
3) The duration of the nano represents how quickly their defenses clear it or when the program finishes it's cycle.
4) The nano cannot run at all if the Psychic value of the mob is above a certain value.
5) Once run then it is no longer anything to do with the caster. It is not a constant battle of wills, rather they are an ignorant slave until the nano is gone. If this were not so I would expect charmed casters to use their buffs and nukes etc while under control. They do not and are for all intents and purposes zombies who only attack with whatever they have in hand.
So - If the charm caster is subsequently debuffed, it should not matter to any curently charmed pets at all - the program is messing with their head regardless.
And yet under the new rules
1) He/she can no longer initiate similar charms - fair enough. Perfectly good.
2) He cannot control his pet(s) and they go into a pet /behind state. Hmmmm - I think this can be reasonably applied to summoned pets for the sake of balance with other professions - debuff=decreased damage capability for duration. I would rather see the pet answer to all commands but function as a lower QL pet, with AMS and DMS affected in similar proportions as a weapon.
3) Charms recalculated against new (debuffed) capability. Incomprehensible. Have the pet go into a /behind state - okay. Debuffed charmer is unfocused and cannot issue necessary mental commands. The recalculation, however, is unfair - what other class except charmers (basically crats) can be debuffed and have their weapon turn around and attack them, as is likely to happen. Not like we would be able to mez the thing with a ransack running, is it?
Debuff = loss of effectiveness with associated risk. It should not be equivalent to an added red mob and total loss of effectiveness.
By these rules, DoTs should stop if the enemy Doc or Agent is debuffed with BioMet incompetence!
Last edited by foolish_child; Mar 18th, 2002 at 18:23:44.
"Lol, everytime a fanboi said we should not complain because AC and HP of mobs would be balanced at the same time as necessary, I answered, they never promised that.
And voila, ain't gonna happen "
read the article.
Hehe...I think I suggested something similiar to this. I never said it was a sane suggestionOriginally posted by foolish_child
Rechecking Charms when debuffed is going too far! It is also inexplicable given the rules and situation they represent. As far as I know, it goes like this :
1) A charm is run as a hostile nano on the mob.
2) Should they not resist then they become subject to the effects of the nano. (in this case, under the contol of the charmer)
3) The duration of the nano represents how quickly their defenses clear it or when the program finishes it's cycle.
4) The nano cannot run at all if the Psychic value of the mob is above a certain value.
5) Once run then it is no longer anything to do with the caster. It is not a constant battle of wills, rather they are an ignorant slave until the nano is gone. If this were not so I would expect charmed casters to use their buffs and nukes etc while under control. They do not and are for all intents and purposes zombies who only attack with whatever they have in hand.
So - If the charm caster is subsequently debuffed, it should not matter to any curently charmed pets at all - the program is messing with their head regardless.
And yet under the new rules
1) He/she can no longer initiate similar charms - fair enough. Perfectly good.
2) He cannot control his pet(s) and they go into a pet /behind state. Hmmmm - I think this can be reasonably applied to summoned pets for the sake of balance with other professions - debuff=decreased damage capability for duration. I would rather see the pet answer to all commands but function as a lower QL pet, with AMS and DMS affected in similar proportions as a weapon.
3) Charms recalculated against new (debuffed) capability. Incomprehensible. Have the pet go into a /behind state - okay. Debuffed charmer is unfocused and cannot issue necessary mental commands. The recalculation, however, is unfair - what other class except charmers (basically crats) can be debuffed and have their weapon turn around and attack them, as is likely to happen. Not like we would be able to mez the thing with a ransack running, is it?
Debuff = loss of effectiveness with associated risk. It should not be equivalent to an added red mob and total loss of effectiveness.
By these rules, DoTs should stop if the enemy Doc or Agent is debuffed with BioMet incompetence!
Seriously, what I had suggested in for pets was a saving throw for the pet owner the instant he gets debuffed. If he loses the saving throw, the pet breaks free. Then the pet gets a straight 50% chance to return to normal or turn on it's former master. They could actually toss in some additional states (like it get's feared and hightails it, goes on a rampage, ect).
Now if the pet owner makes the saving throw, he retains command of the pet. But everytime he issues a new order to the pet while debuffed, we go through the saving throw routine again. We could make it further complicated by having psychology checked for charmed pets or complit checked for bots. Speaking as a trader, I'd enjoy the choice of attempting to improve my odds that your pet will go psycho if I had the appropriate debuffs (trader skill debuffs don't affect psych or complit).
As posted earlier in the threadOriginally posted by killahsin
"Lol, everytime a fanboi said we should not complain because AC and HP of mobs would be balanced at the same time as necessary, I answered, they never promised that.
And voila, ain't gonna happen "
read the article.
Everyone keeps saying the mob's HP won't be getting cut. Perhaps I read Gaute's original statement wrong:
I read this statement as saying that the 'special' mobs, for lack of a better term will be getting their HP reduced while the normal mobs remain the same. So there's not an across the board reduction of HP. But the 'twinked' mobs will be getting reduced.
3. Will the HPs (health points) of the monsters be reduced?
We are going to go through the monsters and evaluate a reduction of hit-points for the most extreme monsters. (That is, a Level 180 Offal Larva has 10 times the amount of HPs that a normal monster has on that level.) Basically, we are going to make the variation smaller; thus the average is somewhat reduced. What I will not do is to reduce the normal monster hit-points at this time. This is not the same as saying that we'll NEVER do it - just that I would like to watch the impact of the current changes first. I am afraid of doing too many changes at the same time, and what the synergy of them might be.
Loosely translated from VagueSpeak (tm): No we won't be reducing the HP of that Old Golfe or Rollerrat because they're normal mobs. But that Cyborg Lieutenant will prolly get tweaked.
That's what Gaute's article actually says, killahsin. Quit trying to fan the flames
Your Cheescake Sucks too!
I know I'm not in the majority here, but as an Engineer, yes twinked within the rules of the game and created well after the 13.6 patch, I am outraged and disgusted by this OE and IP reset. How is it "over-equipping" a bot? Last time I checked the damn bot came out of my inventory when I spawned it. Shouldn't it be a Psychic check (safe from trader debuffs) to see whether I control my hunk-o-tin or not? I mean really, use common sense and don't call it a fix - say it straight - A nerfing of pet professions 100%. I worked my butt off to level my Engineer high enough to create a slayer-droid (accomplished at level 106 with max buffs). Now what? I have to try to blitz to 150 so I can keep control of it? BS! I didn't read any fine print when I started my Engineer that pets were over-equippable OR have potential to lose control. Hell, why don't you have them run a check and have the pet attack the Engineer once in a while - screw it, we have no heals, roots, calms, debuffs or charms ( oh wait Traders have ALL of those! ) let us just die quicker. PvP = Death for all pet classes.
As far as the IP reset goes - BAH ACK ARGH UGH ICK BLAH POO!
If you are going to allow IP resets, then allow me to be able to ONE TIME - change professions. Why not? You are basically allowing players to create a new character anyways, let us change professions too. I'll gladly drop my Engineer into a Trader class, at least I'll still be able to play the gameGaute, really, play the game or follow a twinked character around and find out that the real problems in the game are from so many patches ago that you can't really do anything to those players. As far as the newer twinks in the game go - GOOD FOR YOU!!! You obviously learned the game, used every buff, item and nano to the UTMOST advantage and made yourself powerful - to the exploiters - THANK YOU FOR CAUSING FC TO RUIN THE GAME FOR EVERYONE. You 1% or so out there are causing the other 99% to get pissed off. Anyways my 2 cents worth and I'll stick around to see what happens with the new patch, but probably not long after that.
Anxicor - 123 Engineer
Aaleji - 100 NT
Vision of Disorder
Originally posted by Halbundy
Sraythe,
The glee with which the so-called 'roleplayers' view this upcoming nerf is just more proof to me that 'roleplayers' are largely composed of people that wish they could level but just plain suck at it. What else can explain the bitterness that they ( the 'roleplayers' ) have towards those that play for levels ? It seems to be jealousy, pure and simple, because what one person can solo, in a solo mission, has no bearing on the performance of another player in their mission.
Halbundy
Well I am a heavy roleplayer, but Im also a level 73 doctor twink. So I guess you can be a roleplayer and enjoy leveling and twinking to. I do however agree with you, go to the rompa bar, all you see is 85% of the so called "Roleplayers" are level 5 female characters in skimpy outfits, of course there is the occasional atrox in a bikini..ick. But for a roleplayer of lower level (or even mid to high level) to complain about a serious hardcore gamers twinking? Thats just rediculous, on what grounds can you do this? I mean, your to busy "roleplaying" to twink yourself right? Your to busy enjoying the scenery, untill l33t d3wd 1003 comes up and punks you. Wtf are you doing site seeing in a 0-25% zone anyways? lol. And now to fend off the response "Oh I site see in 75-100% zones". Then the twinking shouldn't effect you at all, who cares if player one is hitting leet for 150 damage, and your doing 30, whos fault is that? Yours. I find plenty of time to site see and stuff, and RP, those of you who have seen Charrity running around know I visit the Rompa bar ect. I do missions with friends, I stop in town to give people the occasional IC...and do my rping for the day. So RPers, it is possible to see the sites, RP, AND twink yourself..I just wish you'd try before complaining. Thank you for whining this patch out of the woodworks, I salute you /sarcasm. This patch will not effect me much at all...but I have many friends I level with that it will effect, and in return effect me, because they are my lifeline as a doctor. So why don't you rpers go stare at a cluster of trees, and let us do our thing, because this patch has fuked alot of us over.
sorry if this makes litle to no sense, if any of you know me from ingame you know I talk alot lol, just my 5 1/2 cr.
If you think that extreme overequipping only affects PvP, you're extremely mistaken. The mobs in the game have been scaled up to prevent people that overequip from ripping through the content. This in turn affects the casual players because they're forced to fight the same mobs that got twinked to present even a minimal challenge to the overequippers.Originally posted by Charrity
Well I am a heavy roleplayer, but Im also a level 73 doctor twink. So I guess you can be a roleplayer and enjoy leveling and twinking to. I do however agree with you, go to the rompa bar, all you see is 85% of the so called "Roleplayers" are level 5 female characters in skimpy outfits, of course there is the occasional atrox in a bikini..ick. But for a roleplayer of lower level (or even mid to high level) to complain about a serious hardcore gamers twinking? Thats just rediculous, on what grounds can you do this? I mean, your to busy "roleplaying" to twink yourself right? Your to busy enjoying the scenery, untill l33t d3wd 1003 comes up and punks you. Wtf are you doing site seeing in a 0-25% zone anyways? lol. And now to fend off the response "Oh I site see in 75-100% zones". Then the twinking shouldn't effect you at all, who cares if player one is hitting leet for 150 damage, and your doing 30, whos fault is that? Yours. I find plenty of time to site see and stuff, and RP, those of you who have seen Charrity running around know I visit the Rompa bar ect. I do missions with friends, I stop in town to give people the occasional IC...and do my rping for the day. So RPers, it is possible to see the sites, RP, AND twink yourself..I just wish you'd try before complaining. Thank you for whining this patch out of the woodworks
sorry if this makes litle to no sense, if any of you know me from ingame you know I talk alot lol, just my 5 1/2 cr.
Or a better question would be:
How far to the right do you move the difficulty slider when getting missions?
I dont agree, their debuffs will be effective vs weapons after the OE nerf, and they are already effective vs nano skills. = a big boost.Originally posted by GOA
LOL garzu,
if you nerf the debuffs, the whole trader profession is gimped.
Traders are easy to gimp, you just need to nerf their debuffs and you got a gimped profession. It would the same as nerfing nuke dmg.
The problem is not the traders, it's the OE patch.
They are the ONLY profession with healing + roots = damn powerful combo. They cannot be gimped in pvp, even if we took away their debuffs completely.
I say it is more than enough with one nano debuffer : MPs, let the trader be the weapon debuffer, which will work after the OE nerf.
NT phone HOME!!
And if there was a profession with the ability to debuff weapon skills only, would it be okay for soldiers to be asking that the weapon skill portion of the debuffs be pulled as well?Originally posted by Garzu
I dont agree, their debuffs will be effective vs weapons after the OE nerf, and they are already effective vs nano skills. = a big boost.
They are the ONLY profession with healing + roots = damn powerful combo. They cannot be gimped in pvp, even if we took away their debuffs completely.
I say it is more than enough with one nano debuffer : MPs, let the trader be the weapon debuffer, which will work after the OE nerf.
Traders are secondary debuffers compared to MPs. A trader can make a NT feel like he's completely unarmed. A MP can completely unarm an NT. Sorry Garzu, but the pet owners have a more valid request than the NT's
Ok..as I read it, here's how monsters work (HP wise anyway)
Each monster type has a base (lvl 18 for offal larvae in Gaute's example), and monsters of the same type have their HP calculated using that base as a start and probably multiplying that by X amount (eg. 1.4 or something similar) or using some other funky formula.
What Gaute is saying is that the BASE critters wont be adjusted, but the formula for all subsequent higher levels of that monster WILL be, hence lowering the HPs on the upper lvl MOBS, but most likely not the first instances of them...
Commander Barron
Prime Director: Omni-1 Operations
2nd in Command
Division 9 [R.S.G.E]
barron@rsge.net
Click Here to Visit the ALL NEW Division 9 Website
I am sick of people whining about nothing.
Before everything, 20% OE is not 20% above your skill. I am just sick of hearing that all the time.
PLEASE READ ALL THE POST HERE BEFORE POSTING.
OK you apologize every time. And what else ??!?
Also everyone is talking about OE rules and don't want to see the primary failure in the formula.
DAMAGE DEAL WITH A WEAPON WILL BE VERY RANDOM TO A COMON PLAYER.
Especially at low level when you can OE very easily (because of your low skill) and also with debuff. Over 20% OE your damage make a loop between 100% damage deal and 125%. A loop. Crazy.
YOU DON'T EVEN SEE YOU COULD SUDDENTLY LOOSE 25% OF YOUR DAMAGE INPUT IN SOME CASE AND JUST LOOSE A SMALL AMOUNT IN OTHER.
This is madness.
I have build a new OE formula very effective you can see in page 19 of this thread. You can found here too a scale of how above your skill you need to be compare to OE. And I have really work on my formula, compare it to many other, and found a good system. So I don't just drop a formula like.
Originally posted by Kuroshio
If you think that extreme overequipping only affects PvP, you're extremely mistaken. The mobs in the game have been scaled up to prevent people that overequip from ripping through the content. This in turn affects the casual players because they're forced to fight the same mobs that got twinked to present even a minimal challenge to the overequippers.
Or a better question would be:
How far to the right do you move the difficulty slider when getting missions?
Maximum at level 73, thats like..ql 125 missions usually..and my partners are in their 80's, I never said mobs dont have insane hp and AC, because they DO, and I see that. I mean in order for an agent to effectively dent a mob he has to crit aim shot or a normal shot :/. Otherwise its a slow and tedious process, and if the doc (me) wasnt there it wouldnt work out. But ya I guess they are going back to what the manual states, Green easily beaten, yellow hard, orange pretty damn hard, and deep red impossible, thats the way it was intended. And believe me I know the xp will be ****ty...but to get xp dont most of you group anyways...? or maybe you should...? and still kill red mobs even after oe...? Because if you think you must solo a deep red mob, or your gimped, your very wrong, thats what this patch adresses :/.
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