Over-equipping - here we go....

[forney]

A lot of people are saying that they will quit due to patch 14.2 But we could turn this around, what would happen if people are leaving the game because patch 14.2 would not happen.
Funcom is balancing the game. It seems that the only thing people are interresting in is getting to level 200 fast. Funcom is making that difficult to do. As it should be, not everyone can get to level 200. As it would be in real life. Not averyone makes it to the board of directors but are still working in a normal departments.
Would it be fun to get in 1 or 2 months to level 200. What are you planning to do after that? Create a new character and get him/her also to level 200? Its plain and simple that a lot of people would drop the game after 2 or 3 chars. The longer it takes to get to level 200 the more money Funcom is making. And also, the longer the game is interresting for the players.
OE never should have happened and i'm glad that it will be shut down. If that means that there are players leaving because of this well go away. The less lag i and others have.

[notrump]

agree 110% with mickey

[Xzeepo]

don't take any effect on the nanos. only the weapons! and the Armor!! Just leave the nanos alone!! i need a higher pet!

[_______________Weylt]

I think this is a great idea, but there some things that could be worked out a little to make it even better

-In determining if an item equipped is actually OE'd there should be a little more room. 20% is not much at all. At low levels (the first 15 levels or so) you are pretty much scrounging for any item around your level, and 20% is simple to bypass. At higher levels as well, the 20% is not hard to pass. Players can pass that mark without even knowing it. So by raising the percentage to 25-30% you leave a "cushion" effect so there is some room.

-However by raising that percentage, the amount of effectiveness lost should also be inreased. Think of an 8 year-old with a gun, they are not going to know what they are doing, and will be lucky if they hit anything, but also may get a few hits in non-vital areas. So raise the lost effectiveness to 30-35% the scenario becomes more "real". And that continues as it would before ( 50-60% over, lose 60-70% ). Now when an item gets to be over 90%, in the weapon case, there should be a chance of the character actually causing a hit to themselves. Back to the kid with the gun, but the gun even more complicated, there are chances of him shooting himself in the foot because he doesn't know what he's doing. This prevents level 7 characters using ql 200 stigmas.

-Now onto the pets. By giving the weapon-bearing classes the slope of losing effectiveness the pet-classes should not lose all 100% in one shot. The main class that would be effected by this would be the engineer, because the meta physicist would be able to buff himself up again once it wears out. The 20% again is way to low, but instead of keeping it aligned with the weapon/armor percentage make it 35% over, and have a 40% chance of not listening to your command. And every time it attacks/heals there is a 20% chance of stopping the fight. And at over the 90+% there is a chance of the pet simply terminating himself. Or perhaps attacking the caster.

-Probably the best way to check if any items are OE'd would have a check on a timer that automatically checks say every 30 mins. If it checked say ever time the item was used, that would only increase lag. If there was a way to make these checks concise and quick, making them check every 30 mins, but not on the half-hour, because people would just OE for 30 mins and get buffed again. Make it at a random +1/1 minute added to the 30 mins.

-No matter what did happen in 13.8, classes, even when minorly OE'd have some trouble killing mobs. So perhaps to regain 20% of the AC and lose 40% of their HPs classes would actually be able to solo yellow mobs.

-A Trader has a Wrangle that lasts 3 minutes. Meta Physicists have buffs that last 30. By using changing this like it is planned, it would make Traders into "gimps" that follow the group around and buff them when they run out, but would make them virtually useless in combat. So the length of wrangle should be increased on bonus side, but stays the same on the trader side. Also, wrangling is a Trader's livelihood and at the moment they have no real use. So to basically nerf this would ruin the class, this preserves some of their usefulness. As a downside in the increase Traders should not have the ability to Ransack skills in PvP.

-The final thing is that this should be tested for a WHILE. This patch will change almost everything, and it should be checked thuroughly before it is implemented.

Well, I probably thought of more before but forgot it now, but I hope that atleast some of this is actually listened because this patch will either make or break AO.

[______Soldats/Chloei]

This patch is absolutely rediculous. I know I may offend some people, but I have to say this for all the people who are thinking the same thing but haven't posted a reply yet.

OE patch is Absurd! There are the tools in the game, buffs, implants, items. There are rules in the game, namely the game's own code. You have a character who represents yourself. Naturally you'd want to give the best representation possible for yourself. You want to stand out from the crowd, look better, wear cooler items, deal more damage, absorb more damage, and cast better nano spells. If a person wants this, he/she can use the "tools" in accordance with the "rules" to make his or her character the best it can be. Also, of course, if a person is content with their character, is too lazy or just doesn't have the rescources yet, he/she won't use the tools in accordance with the rules to their fullest capacities.

However, if a person is content/too lazy/doesn't have the rescources, he/she shouldn't have the right to restrict other players who are willing, determined, and rescourcefull from making their own characters the best it could be. Don't get me wrong, I am 100% against game bug exploits(comp lit, treatment etc), but simple things like implants are obvious, they're right there for you, it's not like it's a secret, everyone knows that there are base stat requirements on implants, and implants increase your base stats, so if you put in one implant to raise your base stats, the next implant you put in can be of a higher quality value. Sorry if this has elluded any of you, but just because some don't want to spend the time "stepping" implants doesn't meant that others shouldn't be able to. If I wanted to play "Communism Online" I'd play a different game, and frankly, if this game turns into that, playing a different game is exactly what I, and many others will be doing.

We come up with scientific and engineering innovations through (excuse the word) "exploiting" properties of the physical world. The OE patch is like putting a ban on Science and engineering. We have the tools at our disposal, we use them in a way that is in accordance to our virtual world's rules, why are you punishing us for being innovative thinkers?

What about those of us who are the proud owners of already twinked characters? Why kill all the hard work and long time that many of us have spent (or have been planning to spend) by making everyone identical? What if I am very partial to a certain weapon that has very poor preformance (*caugh*ninja wakizashi *caugh*) and therefore need to "twink" my character to a very high degree to achieve the same effect as others? This is, after all, a role-playing game.

This is why I think the OE patch should not be applied.

Here's my suggestion, there should be a OE arena and a non- OE arena.

Oh and perish the thought that any of you might be JEALOUS of our superiorly-built characters and that the patch is simply one to down-grade ours instead of having to step-up to the challange.

[______________Giemer]

Aight,
Basicaly this patch is needless, it just removes a part of the game that has been part of the game since the begining. They arent exploits or cheats or anything, its part of the game. Though this patch doesn't realy effect me, its needless. All it will do is piss of 99% of the players most of which were the ones that kept AO going when it was going through all the **** in the begining.

Nothing comes of the OE patch except for weakening ever char in the game, it doesn't make te game more playable, or more enjoyable, just more difficult to do everything.

The game basicaly revolves aorund how you can manipulate your character with the remainder of the world, and has a soul base on IP. Wha nanotech would want to waste 200 IP on strength in order to wear useable aromour, when that same 200 pts can be equal to about 350 nano IP. IPR does not fix this either.

The game isn't hindered in anyway by OE, OE just adds an extra level to the game.

Further more, as to OE being part of the game. With OE in effect all characters will be into hardcore leveling, how else will they be able to better themselves? With the current state there are thousands of ways for a person to strengthen their characters beyond just mere leveling.

Hunterjager had a good point, with OE in effect everyone is just a mere duplicate of everyone else, in an arena situation if 2 lvl 15's go at it who wins? The lvl 15 with a better use of IP? Not even close, the lvl 15 with a better built character.

OE limits the abilities of the players to build, personalize, and enjoy their character.


Anyone who says otherwise is either a player already on the way out, or a new player on the way in, either way you do not gain any respect from destroying what your players have worked for.

[forney]

It's always funny to hear that people try to blackmail the game company. If you dont listen to what i say me and many others will leave this game. They said it to UO, they said it to EQ, they say it now and they will say it when shadowbane and starwars are running. Why is it then that the first two (who are longer running than ao) are still there? Mostly because people have a big mouth and when the time is there to do what they say they wanted to do they back off and keep playing. Me and many others will go play another game, please do it, go away and play another game.

I still can turn it around. Me and many others will leave this game when they dont implement OE. Leaving this game to the twinkies.

Funcom says its a bug. A bug that is around since the beginning. Slowly all the bugs are removed and the game will go the way it should be. If you dont like it leave, dont turn around and look back. The ones who are staying will have less lag.

We will see if they will leave the game. If they do then i must say that they had the guts to do it. If they dont leave, they are nothing more than whiners and i have no sympathy at all for them.

edit: trying to remove some spelling and grammar errors

[______________Giemer]

...Thanks for your thoughts but you missed the point entirely

[Asmodea]

Don't know the problem ? They should make two servers.. one with OE and one without .. simple.

[_____________Marleen]

I feel special, I am one of the .01 percent that do not need to have a crutch such as OE. I am able to level just fine playing the game the way Funcom intended. The beauty of the whole thing is, I never needed to do it and I wont miss it when it is gone. I can't wait for 14.2, Funcom can count on my money next month.

If they don't cast a vote, they must not care enough about it.

[forney]

Giemer i don't miss the point. Or is it that you and the others who dont want this patch to happen are more important then the people who agree with it?
I've seen it happen at other games. People like you where there at UO and EQ. We will quit the game if you change that. Those games are still around so my conclusion is that the people who will quit are a minority of those who will not quit.
I know people who will come back due to this patch. OE is a bug, and you and many others used it to get better and better. This bug will be repaired. And because of that you and others will leave. So leave, the game will run without you.

[hhli-china]

mickey implant stepping was a bug, Overequipping was built into the game.
I've not seen one person yet that is willing to leave because of someone else being a twink, unless you've gotten completely slammed in pvp and aren't willing to invest time into finding out why.

Do I overequip? uhm, yeah, that's why some buffs are there. Is it over this great 20% proposed limit? don't know, don't care.

What does this patch mean? It means that every trader you ever see in a mission (even those grey ones) will own you so bad you'll cry to mama that you wish you never registered an account here.

have fun guys. I agree with a lot on one point, if you're going to leave just do so, sticking around here threatening it makes you look pretty dorky. you're blowing hot air in that case.

[forney]

Ok, OE was build in game. Can be, but i dont think it was ever the intention that a level 120 could use a level 200 weapon, or am i wrong. People still can OE, its only maxed at 20%.

Second, i always have thought that ao was a MMORPG. Which means that you play this game with others. And as long you play this game with others you can slay monsters pretty easy. True there always will be tough monsters to beat, but thats part of the fun. If you could slay every monster with ease the fun of this game would quickly be gone.

So if people say i need to OE because i cant solo anymore thats a poor excuse for me. You're playing a multiplayer game, well use it that way. Find friends, go into a guild. You see a mob you cant slay, call someone to help you out. If you bought this game only to solo then you will have a lot of trouble. If you bought this game to play with other people, well you gonna have a lot of fun.

[Xtremtech]

Pontosaurus, you make the equation far too simple.

If there are enough players in professions like NT, Fixer, MA etc who find themselves consistently outdamaged and outplayed by other characters who didn't need to invest the time and effort to get that damage, then you have a large base of customers who are very unhappy. Those players do leave the game in many cases.

If you have a large character base that are annoyed a lot of the time because their favourite style character is outdamaged and outplayed by other characters, then you have a lot of disaffected customers who aren't recommending the game to other people. Word of mouth forms a large recruitment base for games such as this that have a very long life span. The loss in new players would be appreciably large.

If you have swathes of customers who find that playing a character beyond level 150 is pointless because they already have QL200+ everything equipped, then those characters stop being played (many MPs drop out around 140 because there isn't anything new to get, for example). Let's say it's 50 levels per character of non-play. If the average player has 3 characters that they've played to that level and then leave AO... that's 150 levels of non play. Since those levels are also the hardest levels to achieve, we can say easily that AO would lose out on 4 months worth of subscriptions minimum.

Largely because of over-equipping, the mobs in missions and elsewhere have been upgraded in HP and AC so far that some styles of play, like soloing simply become impossible for many professions. If you have a base of players who spend 2 hours sitting around trying to find a team and 1 hour doing a mission with the team they eventually find, because they can't solo anything meaningful... then thos eplayers will begin to think other games are more and more attractive and leave.

If the items that you need to stay ahead of the curve and remain useful to teams and for soloing are so ludicrously above your level that you can only get them from missions that are way over your head and you need a very good team to get them for you, then you don't feel a sense of personal achievement and get pissed off. Because we can get and use the higher QL ones we do... but if we can't use them effectively, then we can actually solo missions etc in order to get our own weapons.

Tied to this, there's the ever present pressure to level hard and fast to get more and better things. Once the OE changes work their way into the system, I think game play will improve a lot. If mobs and players are more balanced, there will be less pressure and 'need' to get to the next super-gun or the next super-pet. Maybe people will finally start hunting again at higher levels and getting around the countryside and places in AO... that would improve game play for many of those who feel that AO has become a power-levelling game rather than a fun game.

And as more and more people get pushed toward playing the more powerful and successful character types, the less variation you will see in the game. It's already rare to get to team with a fixer these days. Agents are growing fewer in numbers too I fear. I'm told that it's getting harder to find traders recently too... The same goes to an extent for breeds... with NT, MA and MP Atroxes appearing left right and centre. By improving the balance in the game, Funcom can also promote the variety and interest in the game. If there is better balance, then more professions become really viable choices which makes AO better and also provides more desire in players to play all of the professions (which equals lots more months of subscriptions) etc

There's all sorts of things that affect subscription drop rates and the take up of new subscriptions. General happiness of present players, variation of play, the average time that a player stays subscribed etc. Many of these can be directly improved for Funcom by changes such as the Over-Euipping patch. Your equation was waaay to simple.

X

[___________Heirarchy]

Now Engineers/Meta P. don't take this personal... It's not meant as a flame towards the individual. Just as a reality check:

Through out this whole thread, I hear alot of frustration in regards to your pets becoming unresponsive, if 20%+ overequiped. Now The way I see it.

Any Pet based profession should still be able to solo 50% + missions easily. Do mainly to the fact that they have PETS. Even a non OE'd pet has more AC then an average player, more Health then the average player. Then you also have to take into concideration the fact that "they are tanking" for you. While you sit back and laugh as you unload on them as well.

But seriouly

You make it sound like you are just standing around doing absolutely nothing while your pets do ALL the work.

Don't you relize Every other "non pet-based" profession does it everyday.


Nothing personal. Just didn't see the "real problem"

[______________Taseti]

Originally posted by Erelius


Sure we are....

Nonametrader did 200 damage to NonameMP
Rage Materliazation did 174 dmage to Noname
Nonametrader forces NonameMP's NCU to run Plunder Skills (Major)
NonameMP was healed for 200 points by Valentiya
Rage Materlialization did 160 damage to NonameTrader
Valentyia - "I will be glad to stay back for a while"
Valentyia - "No, I won't do that master"
NonameTrader did 210 damage to NonameMP
Noname MP dead

Um...no!

The pet WILL CONTINUE to fight, therefor, the Trader will again die and be the MP'S *****!! Hehe... Now, the Trader can do that then root the pets & MP, drain the MP of his ability to cast nukes and then proceed to shoot large holes in the MP.

[___________Daystlker]

with this patch will we be able to retreave ip that we have used in the past of did i misunderstand

[_____________Marleen]

I would have to agree with Heirarchy. I do play a engineer and I don't see what the big deal is. I have to admit that I am self buffed and my pet isn't able to take on red mobs But who really should. Without OE, I guess we are going to have to learn how to play the game the way Funcom really wanted us to. I guess thoes who have to have OE will just have to find another bug to exploit. I find it a shame that Funcom has to spend so much time removing exploits instead of spending time on the real problems such as lag and content.

[___________BigKiller]

omfg thie patch is gonna **** fun com up the ass ...

1. all the people on this post saying it is good are the lil newbs that always got their asses killed in 3 hits in pvp, or are the 1's that are gelious of the other people that are twinked out, and can do mroe dmg then them.

2. u are changing a part of the game that is available to every 1, and you are making it so noone can make mistakes, which is a big ass mistake... u have to let people play, screw their characters up the ass, and start new 1's from scratch with the understanding of what to do where to go, and how to equip yer guy.

3. u are saying that oe was available to people ith only rich friends and previous characters that are rich ... well no ****, wait maybe me should make everything in the stores free too so that the newbs will have the same chance the rich people will have ... if yer rich yer gonna have betetr stuff, and if yer rich yer gonna have stuff that lets u kill newbs in pvp in 3 hits... if u where rich in real life would u drive a 10 year old car like the next joe blow or would you drive a vet or a bmw or the like.

4. have any of u developers played characters over lvl 80 and tried to solo missions ... its hard enough as it is, and takes a hella long time if u get a long mission ... now think about missions at lvl 100+ i have troulle with some of the mobs in those missions with a lvl 200 nova on at lvl 100 lvl 150 armor, and useing mk 5 ... and all u low lvl newbs complaining don't realize it, cause uve never been that high a lvl to experience it ...

5. yer gonna reduce armor ac by 25% if the armor is 20 % higher then yer lvl ... ummm well thats gonna work good, since armor doesn't increase its ac where at lvl 100 armor and lvl 80 armor are 20 % difference in ac... and how bout the people that have armor 1% higher, so now their wearing armor thats a lower lvl then them cause u gimp them, what should they do? go do missions or try to buy another full set of armor, which at high lvls ... well as high as they go in stores 125 cost millions ... hmmm lets go do missions for them, can't now cause yer ac is messed up, yer guy can;t kill anything anymore cause monsters are way too strong ... etc etc etc

6. people are buff factories? u know that old saying JUST SAY NO, use it if u don;t wanna buff, jesus christ !... also some professions only source of income in game is to BE A BUFF FACTORY... mp's traders and doctors would make their money buffing people, no use for that now... those proffesions go from being of the richest to the poorest, now we can;t buy anything in stores, w00t GG funcom.

7. after lvl 100 every 1 overequips, in some cases it starts sooner then that...

8. OE IS NOT A BUG OR AN EXPLIOT U STUPID NEWBIES !!! ITS AVAILABLE TO EVERY 1, U SOLO RED MOBS TO LVL FASTER, DO U KNOW HOW LONG IT TAKES TO LVL UP ON GREEN MOBS AT LVL 120 !??!?! NO CAUSE YER PROLY LVL 10-40 U CAN GET TO LVL 40 IN A DAY THATS HOW EASY IT IS, AT LVL 180 IT TAKES A DAY TO GET 1 LVL ON RED MOBS. if funcom didnt; want oe they shouldn;t have put so many buffs into the game, or made them sellf only ... now yer.. now yer just ruining the game

9. have any of u people saying GO, KILL THE OE'ers, fought a lvl 170-200 enforcer mob that has essence of god running on it?? the enforcer is so big in the mission only half of its body will b visible, now, try to solo what takes an oe group litterally 5 mins to kill ... WHILE its hitting the tanking pets for 400-1000 every hit... umm for 1 thing max ac by armor is around 5k .... at 4k the enfrocer does 300+ dmg, now kinksta the lvl 200 solitus enforcer has around 10k hp, while dishing out around 500-2.5k dmg each hit depending on crits, now take into account the mob has around 200-800k hp, and don;t say thats impossible or i'm full of ****, cause i've fought them, and when i do 4 1500 dmg crits in a row and its hp don't move while the other 5 eopel in my group ar hitting for more or less around the same amount... it has that much more more hp... how is the lvl 200 enfrocer gonna kill the enforcer mob, now if u calculate hit for hit, taking into account mobs heal themselves now, and what the max first aid kit can heal every 45 secs (being 1k hp) and that the mob hits every 1-3 secs, who is gonna win that battle, even calculate JUST the crits of the enforcer... hmmm he still loses cause mobs are uber strong after lvl 80 ....


way to try to help the newbs and try to make money, instead of keeping yer player base, and drawing in the poeple that will play longer then the average n00b that figures out eventualy that this isthe same thing over and over again, q then l then m then wait then 2 then wait ... sweeeeet the monster is dead lets do that 800 more times !!! awwwsome nothing more to do, no more taking time off of the same thing of killimg monsters over and over again to go in teh city and buff people for money, or just buff people at all !!! w0000t

i suggest u guys really think about what yer doing befor u ruin what u;ve put so much money into...

but that i say won;t make a difference cause u've alrdy made up yer mind to screw the game up, o well time for me to sell my aco**** !!@!

[forney]

Must be difficult for you to write something in normal English isn't it??