Over-equipping - here we go....

[Sarelron]

Originally posted by Subject IV
- Mochams, Infuses and Masteries were THE ONLY WAY we could create a bot that could handle a mission at 70%. Now, 50% is the best we can do.

As you should be. As everyone should be. It's been mentioned again and again. People should *not* be able to solo a 70% mission effectively. You should only have a 30% chance of completing it.

- The only reason an engie survives at all in a team, is because the bot gets hit and not us. By making our bots only even to us, we will die far more than before. You think this is good Soldiers and Enforcers? Who the hell will Beacon Warp you now when we are dead

Actually, like every other class, you can use up to 20% over your skills. Keep yourself buffed and you can use a bot above your level.

Sarelron

[Wrekk]

Oh no. Are you really sure you wanna do this Funcom? I agree on your equiping policy in general, but do you really want the engineers to not be able to control their pets when the buff runs out? Its bad enough that i have to spend time every time i log on to find a MP or trader to buff me so that i can get a decent bot. I really hope you dont do this Funcom. I was enjoying playing as an engineer and quite happy in Rubi-Ka. I put a lot of effort and time into building my character. Now a game rule change is being made that severly will change the way i can play. I am not happy with this. Listen to the us plz. You will loose good customers this way if you carry on.

[___________Zeroshift]

Ok, sorry for the flame above.... but I have two simple questions if you could please address them CZ:

1. Can you still do the IP relocation with IQ rings on?

2. Will mob HP be decreased to account for the drastic drop in player power? (If I remember correctly, they buffed up mobs considerably to address overequiping months ago.)

[Bionitrous]

At one point in time I got lauds of respect from other players with my second character for doing the following:

1. Deciding to be BETTER than the average player.

2. Scanning hundreds of missions before AOMD for a Stigma Rifle on a 100% mission.

3. Paying another character to go in the mission with me and retrieve it.

4. Checking out the shopping channels and stores for a rifle that raises agility. Buying it.

5. Checking out the shopping channels and stores for a rifle that raises Rifle, and Aimed shot.

6. Planning implants, shopping for implants (before it became easy). Surgery implants, complit implants, agility implants, higher agility implants, rifle implants, sense implants.

7. Finding and Engineer that used to hang out at the BB in Old Athen (before he quit because you can't advance through tradeskills). Paying him to put together all my implants. Had some nice conversations.

9. Befriending a Doctor that used to hang out in Newland. (Before he quit because the only way for him to level was to Kill or help Kill). Paying him to help me put in implants.

10. Befriending one of the first really high level agents to lay down Feline Grace, Sniper's Bliss, Enhanced Senses, Agility Boost, Sense Boost ... the whole nine yards to get my Rifle that raised agility in so that I could ...

11 Go back to my friend the doc to have him help me get one higher level set of implants in with my extra 20 Agility so that I could ....

12. Make friends with a higher level Trader who helped me get a LL Targetting scope in (oh, he had buffed my CompLit, too. Was legal back then) so that I could ...

13 Go back to my Agent friend to lay down Feline Grace, Sniper's Bliss, Enhanced Senses, Agility Boost, Sense Boost ... the whole nine yards to get my Rifle that raised Rifle skills on so that I could ...

14 Slide into the weapon that I wanted to in the first place.

God, that was fun. I think it was over a course of two weeks. I didn't spend a single minute mindlessly plunking away at stupid AI-controlled MOB's. This was a game that required some brains for once. No cheating or exploiting required to have a good time. It required social interaction. If you knew what you were doing, you could differentiate yourself from the gazillion other players in your profession at your level. It MEANT something to be good.

And why did I do this? Not to lord it over the ignorant who dabbled in PvP like those who got the Agent class destroyed. I did it simply for some sense of self-satisfaction of knowing that I could be a better AO player than some (while not as good as others). I did it to know I could excel in a game that while fun seemed to have very little of value to compare between players.

I mean, I could probably program a packet sniffer to level you to 200 in a backyard training ground. Character level means absolutely NOTHING in this game as far as skill is concerned. It just means you've got time.

Now, for all that effort the character above would be PUNISHED? She would probably have her output reduced by 100%. What does this mean to us? NO damage?

How the designers of other games like DAoC, EQ, Shadowbane, etc. must be laughing their butts off at the cop-out the poor guys at FunCom are being forced into taking. This change is far worse in scope than the disaster of 12.6. I really expected an elegant solution that while scaling back the inequities introduces by freakish overequipping would NEVER artificially limit a character to the point where it was simply impossible to ever get better without climbing back on the g-d leveling treadmill.

What the heck is there to show another player that you are a veteran and are able to 'play' the game better than a newb? Your friggin' 'level'? Screw that. Anybody can level. There's gonna be nothing left to differentiate the clueless idiot from the guy with a clue.

Kinda like Tic-Tac-Toe, even a chicken can be taught to win if you let him go first. That appears to be the Anarchy Online that FunCom wants. Hope there are a lot of chickens out there with access to daddy's credit card.

[_____________Gokudan]

Originally posted by MechRabbit
Oh no. Are you really sure you wanna do this Funcom? I agree on your equiping policy in general, but do you really want the engineers to not be able to control their pets when the buff runs out? Its bad enough that i have to spend time every time i log on to find a MP or trader to buff me so that i can get a decent bot. I really hope you dont do this Funcom. I was enjoying playing as an engineer and quite happy in Rubi-Ka. I put a lot of effort and time into building my character. Now a game rule change is being made that severly will change the way i can play. I am not happy with this. Listen to the us plz. You will loose good customers this way if you carry on.

Let's just say this again on equipping, if they want to use some form of cap, it should be on the LVL of the char, it's fair that if someone is twinked up to a gun of their lvl because they don't use IP in that skill, and the crit rate is much less if they don't have the skill, as well as the ability to hit something.

All I'm gonna say is, if they do this, they're gonna lose more people than they gain.

And on another note, the nice new mods to the MA class, except for armour, the MA is not gonna be gimped in anyway possible - well done Funcom on making this class the most dominant :P

[Sarelron]

Originally posted by Fongsayyuk
Many people mentioned this in intelligent previous posts already; if, even through WEEKS and MONTHS of dedication, your character STILL wont be any better than the same lvl char of Joe Average, there is simply no way to excel, or have fun.

I really don't understand. You, and many other posters, claim that nerfing OE will make the game so everyone is the same, because you won't be able to tweak your character. Maybe it's just me, but there's a hell of a lot more to tweaking a character than getting a wrangle for your next weapon. What about implants? Implants, if done correctly, are *very* effective, and getting a nice set on takes a lot of time, dedication, and investment. You think the average Joe is going to go through what I did to get a full set of QL 130ish implants in at lvl 75?

There are *so* many ways to tweak your character, through leveling, spending thousands of IP points per level in 90 different skills, across several professions and breeds, toss in implants, and you think that simply not being able to wear equipment 20% beyond your abilities is going to make everyone the same?

I don't see it.

Sarelron

[____________Moondawg]

I commend Funcom on the upcoming changes. They sound promising. I am, however, distressed to see that Funcom believes that AO is running better than ever when that is simply not the case. After the last couple patches, things were introduced into the game that makes it worse than it was before and there have been numerous posts on these boards about it with no response or acknowledgement from Funcom. Prior to those patches, I ran fine, but now experience drops, lock-ups, tremendous sync problems and other game killing bugs. Why is Funcom ignoring these issues? These are the ones that will drive the players away. Funcom took a tremendous step backwards with those patches and for them to come out and say that AO is now running better than ever shows that they are clueless as to what really is going on in the game.

[___________Zeroshift]

I am a level 66 agent.

I have 153 NCU, a QL 143 counter sniper rifle, an QL 125 implants.

I love the idea of an overequiping nerf.

Don't label people as "too lazy to twink" just because they like the OE nerf.

Most here are just selfish. They don't want to lose their uber bots, or they uber twinked vector. They are selfish because they are not thinking of the the game as a whole, just themselfs.

They balanced mobs against the overequipers. This has hurt the true newbies, or those too poor to twink, tremendously.

[_____________Gokudan]

Originally posted by Zeroshift
I am a level 66 agent.

I have 153 NCU, a QL 143 counter sniper rifle, an QL 125 implants.

I love the idea of an overequiping nerf.

Don't label people as "too lazy to twink" just because they like the OE nerf.

Most here are just selfish. They don't want to lose their uber bots, or they uber twinked vector. They are selfish because they are not thinking of the the game as a whole, just themselfs.

They balanced mobs against the overequipers. This has hurt the true newbies, or those too poor to twink, tremendously.

Sorry Zeroshift, u are a lvl what using what QL gun, speak sense

[Sarelron]

Originally posted by Zeroshift
They balanced mobs against the overequipers. This has hurt the true newbies, or those too poor to twink, tremendously.

Amen.

Sarelron

[_________machievelli]

The official news release states the following:

"All weapons more than 20% over-equipped will have DamageBonus, DamageMin and DamageMax reduced with 25%. (DamageMax is the base maximum damage of your weapon. DamageMin is the base minimum damage of your weapon.)

The definition of over-equipped (OE) is: using a weapon if any one of the user's skills/abilities isn't within 20% of what the weapon requires. The formula is:

OE = 100 - (Your Buffed Skill or Ability / Requirement in Same Skill) x 100. If this formula yields 20 or higher, your weapon is over-equipped."

My questions are these: does the 20% apply to EACH skill that is required of a gun?

Example: Nova Flows require asst. rifle, burst, fling, ranged energy. If any of these skills is below 20% is the gun nerfed?

Also, if ALL of the skills are below 20%, will the modifier be multiplied?

example: burst and fling both below 20% -- is there only one 25% penalty or two??

Is the adjustment based on the lowest skill requirement of your gun?

example: you burst skill is 20% below that required -- so, 25% penalty BUT your asst. rifle skill is 55% below required -- so 50% penalty -- which applies???

Thanks.

-Machievelli

[______________Takuan]

Lol

The MA class doesn't become dominant with this change. All this does is take the one class that can't over equip without gimping itself and put a level playing field in place between levels 1-140. After 140 over equipping really doesnt matter any more as most people can equip their own weapons and the battle then is over ridiculous Crits.

As a 167 MA I get zero benefit out of this patch and also zero problems. Anyone worth PVP'n against can self equip their own weapons. The people that get hurt are everyone with a dark blue shot gun skill that decided they need to get that QL 200 shottie on to compete with soldiers.

[____________Maitrize]

Actually.
Now I'm REALLY pissed.
Wrangles aren't overequipping SINCE THEY'RE A PART OF THE GAME.
Funcom GAVE us wrangles.
Now they're calling it overequipping.
They GAVE us range.
They nerfed it. Calling it an exploit.

Really.
I mean.
Yeah OVEREQUIPPING needs to be fixed.
But wrangles are a TRADER NANO PROGRAM.
It's NOT AN EXPLOIT.
STOP CALLING THIS AN EXPLOIT.
*growls*
Nerfing these saying they're exploits is totally unfair.
Before FC has said that EXPLOITS are BUGS that are EXPLOITED and not intended for the GAME STRUCTURE.

OBVIOUSLY wrangles were MEANT to be used.
Poo on FC if they didn't figure that ENGINEERS would use wrangles for bigger bots or a 150+ wrangle meant you could get a gun on past that 20%.

ARGH!
That's SO jacked up.
SOOOO jacked up.

Make . higher than ql 200.
Do something.
Do ANYTHING...
but don't claim you'll stop nerfing then NERF MORE under the guise of FIXING BUG EXPLOITS.

Flame at will.

[Ditka]

Originally posted by EvilGlitch


MP's can calm. That's what the third pet does. When you see the Yellow Clam glow you just have to give the /pet behind command. The mob stays calmed. MP's can calm just as good, in fact better. They can stay at 100% health through the whole ordeal on top of it and never run out of nano...

ohh man

ohh wow

ohh

my sides hurt so much.

No the mez pet is very random, and does NOT CALM, NOT EVER.
The mez pet clears the hate list, if the mob is aggro, when it sees something it dosent like, it will attack again. At best, the mez pet interrupts some attacks. Thats not to say its not useful, but its no Calm.

[_____________Gokudan]

Right, in reply to my posts (I got my weapon stats)

The weapon I'm using at lvl 38
QL 58 Vector ND - 260 Shotgun - I have 250 buffed
Damage - 6-129 (267)

At lvl 40 with my Deprive and Ransack (the biggest advantage of being a trader which this will nerf)
QL 78 Vector LIZARD ND - 362 Shotgun - 260 buffed at lvl 40 + 102 in ransack/deprive
Damage - 6-175 (363)

That is done with implants (only QL 30 ones), buffs and my trader nanos. I have not once been twinked as this char and I have QL 50ish armour on thx to my implants and buffs as well (they won't be affected since I can now take them on & off as I plz)

[_____________Crymcyn]

Originally posted by Subject IV
Here is why the Engineer just got hosed:

- Mochams, Infuses and Masteries were THE ONLY WAY we could create a bot that could handle a mission at 70%. Now, 50% is the best we can do.

Most profs have to struggle with 50% missions already. Cry me a river.

- The only reason an engie survives at all in a team, is because the bot gets hit and not us. By making our bots only even to us, we will die far more than before. You think this is good Soldiers and Enforcers? Who the hell will Beacon Warp you now when we are dead?

No one said your bot is going to be even to you. Without any OE at all (the whole time my bot exists, I have the skill to call up another one just like him) I can have a bot 10 or more levels higher than myself. Assume you're talking about a bot that requires a 250 skill and your skill is only 201. Someone gives you a mastery and *poof* you have your new bot that is even higher than what I just mentioned. You won't lose control of that bot when the mastery wears off because you're still only OE by 20%.

[locomdenom]

Originally posted by Maitrize
They GAVE us range.
They nerfed it. Calling it an exploit.

Range was nerfed because the game structure allowed it to be exploited. Mobs perception limited at 40 meters. That's why range is capped at 40 meters. If you could shoot a mob from outside it's perception, you could kill it with zero risk to yourself - EXPLOIT.

[_____________Krystka]

Originally posted by Azzazzimon
I think it's great that FC do something but it still doesn't look like they understand that nano skills can't be "overequiped" at all.

I have to disagree here.. .. as my NT When I group with an MP I ask for masteries so that I can cast BIGGER programs while I am in that group. Is that not better? Not to mention when I DO cast those bigger spells my damage will not be lowered due to the OE issue at all.

Saying that you cannot overequip nano programs is just silly. Thanks.

[_____________Gokudan]

Originally posted by Takuan
Lol

The MA class doesn't become dominant with this change. All this does is take the one class that can't over equip without gimping itself and put a level playing field in place between levels 1-140. After 140 over equipping really doesnt matter any more as most people can equip their own weapons and the battle then is over ridiculous Crits.

As a 167 MA I get zero benefit out of this patch and also zero problems. Anyone worth PVP'n against can self equip their own weapons. The people that get hurt are everyone with a dark blue shot gun skill that decided they need to get that QL 200 shottie on to compete with soldiers.

Lol, I agree even though I mentioned it, but I reckon the answer to FC's damn problem is right in front of their face.

Simple answer, see if people notice it since this is third time lucky

If the weapon is over 20% higher than the skills needed - make it do the damage equivalent to a weapon that is 20% higher than your skills, it's easy and so goddamn obvious

[Jentai]

...then have all implants on all characters bumped out on the day of the patch. There are people with Ql200 implants who are going to still be benefitting from gear that they should NOT be using. Otherwise this is just yet another in a long line of "here's our changes, but if you got in there and "cheated" early the world is your oyster" patches that you do so well that keep your player-base low.

JenTai