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Thread: Discuss: 13.8 Token changes

  1. #41
    Great change Funcom...
    There aint any problem to get tokens in low lvls(lvl 100 and below) but its damn hard after lvl 120. I am very lucky if iI can do a 50% mission and it takes 1-3 hours.

    There aint any XP or loot I have use of in 50% missions so I have stopped to do solo missions 30 lvls ago.

    So both token changes and team missions are great changes.
    Lona
    Techno-Mage

  2. #42
    I have 460+ token now at level 115.

    Was aiming for 1k tokens by level 200.

    I leveled up from level 1 to 50 entirely in mission and gathered 250 tokens by then.

    I reached 400 tokens by level 100.

    This change is a slap in the face.

    I should have power leveled outdoors instead of spending all my time doing missions.

    If this goes in... u will see every tom, dick and harry walking around with 1k token board....

    If u are worried about token farming, then restrict the number of tokens a player can upload to his board based on his tittle level. Set the limit to be the next tittle board that he can work for.

    eg. at level 15, u can have at most 60 tokens, at level 30 (err.. if that the next tittle level?) at most 120 and so on. At level 100, 1000 tokens.
    Last edited by Ashuras; Feb 19th, 2002 at 10:21:09.

  3. #43
    Good work FC, now it may be possible to get 1000 tokens before the 4 yrs are up. Now fix the team missions so we can team and socialise while getting them

    And don't say this will make 1000 easy, it wont, and the bonus for having 1000 tokens is not worth spending 6 hrs/day for 300+ playing days. And all those days gone without doing nothing else than doing (mostly solo) missions.

    Good move FC, not all of us can spend 24/7 playing AO.
    NT = Nerfed Technician

    My doctor told me I am paranoid, so I shot him.

    Obviously he was an alien agent sent here to kill me...and he did not come alone!

  4. #44

    Re: Discuss: 13.8 Token changes

    Originally posted by Cz
    • You should get more "points" from each token at higher levels! This should now better reflect the time it takes to get the tokens at higher levels. Please do not see this as us "devaluating" your past accomplishments.
    Well I play higher level chars, so great for me...of course that imbalances PvP even more, as now high level players have a good chance to get the uber 1000 token board, and can rule even more than they already do. The 75+ free for all rule is just insane.
    RK1 Guild Apocalypse

    Dillon "Duradas" Belote, Fixer
    Kiyoko "Selarana" Vallone, Meta Physicist
    Donald "Jorman" Dublin, Bureaucrat
    Burl "Gnorrg" Marinos, Enforcer
    Florence "Florania" Aronstein, Doctor
    ----
    RK3, Arnold "Gideon" Reineman, Enforcer

  5. #45

    Question Info of the change wanted?

    Anyone know if the number of token is based on the lvl of the mission or the size?

    If it is based on the mission lvl, i would think it is to easy to get a small mission, and a lot of tokens.

    Maby it should be based on the size of the mission?
    Comments?

    Stoffer lvl 61 Doc (40 Tokens)
    DrStoffer lvl 30 Doc (6 tokens)

  6. #46

    Re: Discuss: 13.8 Token changes

    Originally posted by Cz
    • You should get more "points" from each token at higher levels! This should now better reflect the time it takes to get the tokens at higher levels. Please do not see this as us "devaluating" your past accomplishments.
    • There is now a chance of getting a special token reward for killing sided monsters.
    I would be very interested in seeing some hard numbers on the "Points" system.

    I would also be interested in specific info on the "special token reward for killing sided monsters" is this for all sided mobs or just some of them? In any mission I get to BS, I can see dozens of sided mobs. Will this apply to only outdoor mobs or to mission mobs as well?

    Originally posted by Khayne
    I have to agree though that it does dilute the efforts put into getting there, no doubt about it. You CAN get tokens REAL easily at high levels. You just have to take small missions. Grey cave missions are usually small, and some locations spawn small missions a lot. So the argument that its impossible to get a 1000 board at high levels is not something im buying. It just takes an effort. If you ask me, its supposed to take an effort.
    - Khayne
    Othar Lvl 83 Enforcer
    Bane Lvl 43 NT
    Pardon me for saying this, but at lvl 83, you have no idea what high level missions are about. Sure, we get the same grey cave missions, but they are usually far from a city and are not that easy.

    I have to say that I really OBJECT to people saying farmers and exploiters in the same breath! Exploiters duped and traded tokens. Hence the term "Exploiters". Farmers have done nothing wrong except take advantage of the ease at which a low lvl character gets a token. I have a lvl 155 Enforcer with only 97 tokens. I started as a neutral and didn't really have any idea that tokens could help so much. The dozens of missions I ran from lvl 1-20 made me no tokens at all! The only reason I have 97 tokens now is that I play alot of missions with teams so getting xp and getting a token go hand in hand. At my level, I can get 1 token an hour possibly 2 if I am very lucky and have very small missions that are not too far away. My lvl 8 MA can get 6 tokens per hour. Sure, it is much faster, but it still involves 166 hours of game play even if you maintained that pace for every single hour of play. At 5 hours a day, this is 33 days of play to achieve. Those 33 days are not fun and they are not entertaining, hence, I see them as just as much work and as hard earned as anything else in this game. I am all for getting more tokens per mission and adding tokens in for certain kills. I finally see it as reasonable to get my 1k board. Notice I didn't say easy or quick, I just said reasonable.

    As for the people that think the 1k board should be a "monumental" thing. If it is supposed to be that difficult, why can we equip it at lvl 100? I would be in favor of making different token board only usable at title lvl 5. This could still act as the "holy grail" of token boards.
    Last edited by Obitus; Feb 19th, 2002 at 12:04:37.
    O b i t u s Atrox Clan Enforcer My trade skill? Smackin' stuff till it cries! Obi's Rig
    Unit Memer of S t o r m


    Never Forget

  7. #47
    I think getting tokens should be easier but that the token farming should be wiped away somehow.
    Some of you guys play A LOT and say it's easy to get to lvl 200 and that getting 1000 tokens should be done appearantly only once because it's a 4 year game... That means you can only enjoy one type of profession, use the same character for 4 years to be able to get 1000 tokens??? Wow that's sick... I want to enjoy all carriers and also enjoy getting them at high lvls.
    Problem is, I don't spend 12 hours a day (or maybe even more for some) to have the privilege to say "this game is too easy to beat".
    I find it hard and can play only 3 times a week and not for excessively long. Why give only "hardcore gamers" the advantage to get to the 1000 token? No way! It needs to be more accessable.

  8. #48
    What we need here is a complete explination of how this "new" system works, or is it all simply random?

    The challenges in AO are slowly going they way of UO.
    Currently at Level 94 I have 391 tokens.
    I have only terminated THREE times sincle level 1 and that was because my character had become stuck and I couldn't wait to be released.

    What Funcom needs to do is stop the "power gamers" and the like who constantly farm tokens at low levels, force them to follow the same route as everyone else to get tokens.

    Giving the ability for everyone to quite easily get the 1000 token board is not the way to solve this problem, again this seems to be taking a leaf out of UO's books, always look for the easy fix rather than taking your time over a much better thought out one.

    There are not that many token farmers and if they want to live a sad life of terminating after every mission so that they have 1000 tokens by Level 10 then let them get on with it - not that many people could stick that out and those that do, well, sad.
    However if somebody wants to be sad and do this then it should be a boring, annoying theing for them to have to do - this change can only help them.

    If you want to bring in such rules than maybe you need to remove the chance of getting tokens in the first place, at the moment any 50% mission that ahs 80-100% of mobs wiped out will almost definately give you a token, maybe the chances of actually getting the tokens should be reduced.

  9. #49
    Oh, addition:

    I keep seeing so many posts on this thread:

    "Without the changes it would take me xxx hours to get to the next token board"
    or
    "I have the xxx token board, I'll never see the xxx token board, great change"

    The answer to that - Then don't do missions, don't attempt to get the higher level board.
    You made your choice, you choose between levelling up by fighting mobs in teams out in the open or in dungeons or you had the choice to do missions.
    You choose levelling over tokens and now you want an easy way to get tokens too.

    Lets look at the people in favour of this change:

    1. Power Levellers - As said above, you decided to level as fast as possible, so why should you have an easy route to tokens?
    2. People who don't get to play much - I'm sorry you don't get time to play AO that much, but, in all these games time equals reward and that, however cruel it may sound, is the bottom line.
    Good old UO again ruined that by allowing characters to become GM in skills within 2 weeks - the end of UO!
    3. Lazy people who feel the game owes them everything - Effort equals reward, as above.
    4. Power Gamers who must have the best - Then go into the missions as they currently stand with your Level 100 character, dressed in his QL200 armour and using his QL200 gun that you managed to squeeze into with all those loevely buff's and get the missions done, don't become one of the lazy ones.

  10. #50
    Great, I love this idea. At level 6 I can get 12 tokens per hour, at 120+ it's more like 1 token per 4 hours. (Taking into account that you only get one out of every 6 missions, all the waiting involved in teams, the time it takes to roll a mission in home etc.)

    Now why should someone who took advantage of the system (I'm not calling it an exploit) and /terminated every 3 missions for a couple of weeks be better off than someone who played the game the way it was meant to be played?

    The way I see it this change just levels the playing field and gives people a chance to get tokens at about the same rate regardless of their level.

    I got more tokens than most at my level, but I don't consider this a "devaluation" of my effort. I just think of it as me having a head start on everyone else when this new system comes into the game.

  11. #51

    Thumbs up YES!

    I think this is great news!
    At lvl 108, my missions usually takes 2-3 hours so a reward of
    more that 1 token is very welcome!!

  12. #52
    On test I've raised a newbie Fixer to 15 since 13.8 went in - all in solo missions. I've gotten one (1) "bravery" token for a sided NPC in one of my last missions yesterday. I've read some global messages from testers in their hundreds (levels) who were rewarded by as many as 4 tokens (it's actually one token that adds 4 to the total count on your board). Think about how long a mission takes at level 100+ and this sounds like a very welcomed change.

    They are appreciated when awarded. The affect is probably a lot less than the nay-sayers are imagining, and a lot less than the rest of us would hope for. But it definitely makes missions more attractive by adding at least the possibility of a little extra reward.

    I like it a lot.
    "Life is too short to drink bad ale."

  13. #53
    Originally posted by RedSonja
    What Funcom needs to do is stop the "power gamers" and the like who constantly farm tokens at low levels, force them to follow the same route as everyone else to get tokens.
    So you would have a homogenous world where nobody can ever outshine anybody else in either effort or enginuity??

    Just because you don't do it, or didn't think of it, doesn't mean it is bad. I had a buddy that had a lvl 97 soldier who rerolled an enforcer when I was lvl 100. He is now 6 levels above me. By being smarter and faster, he overcame a 100 level deficit to pass me. I don't belittle him and call him names. I give him congrats on his effort and success. After all, he did not exploit or do anything that was not within the rules of the game.

    By labeling people that might be a little smarter or a little faster than you, you are punishing them for their success. Just because you can afford a Ferrari and I can only afford a Hyundai, I am not going to condemn you.

    I am glad that tokens will now be more accessable and that more people will have teh 1k board. This is how it should be.
    Last edited by Obitus; Feb 20th, 2002 at 06:14:39.
    O b i t u s Atrox Clan Enforcer My trade skill? Smackin' stuff till it cries! Obi's Rig
    Unit Memer of S t o r m


    Never Forget

  14. #54

    Great idea!

    First of all I'd like to say that a little bit more information on this change would be most definitely welcome.
    Over all I think it is a wonderful idea - especially in light of the fact - that team missions (where all in the team are supposed to get a token) have been broken forever.

    I'm Lvl 146 Agent now. For about the last 100 Lvls I've not (or only with great trouble) been able to solo missions that give me a token. Hardly worth the effort and time.. so - yes - this change is most certainly welcome.
    I also used to think Levelling was too easy - I don't any more.
    If you're only a casual gamer - you might get up to Lvl 100 rather fast, but believe me - after that it gets tough - and - what's worse - boring. Any change to make it more worth your while is very, very welcome!!!!

  15. #55

    Re: Re: I don't get it!

    Originally posted by Zeroshift


    Exactly.. This game is too easy to "beat"

    If you haven't got a life and play this game non stop, sure, it's easy.. Most of us have other things to do too and shouldn't have to wait 4 years to "beat" the game
    Splatmaker

    Proud Ragnarok member

    Splatmaker -- Enforcer
    Darquan --Soldier (Retired)

    "Stop wasting air on my planet" - Meetloaf
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  16. #56

    Re: Re: Discuss: 13.8 Token changes

    Originally posted by Obitus



    Pardon me for saying this, but at lvl 83, you have no idea what high level missions are about. Sure, we get the same grey cave missions, but they are usually far from a city and are not that easy.

    And how are your mission different from a lvl83 mission ?

  17. #57
    Size and difficulty level of the mobs

  18. #58

    Re: Re: Re: Discuss: 13.8 Token changes

    Originally posted by BrutalThug

    And how are your mission different from a lvl83 mission ?
    I doubt very much if you've been hit by an Izzy's Last Word for 4-8k worth of damage (by the way these are usually cast within 5secs unlike the PC version that takes 20secs.

    I also doubt you get to fight mobs with 100,000 hp's (and no that isn't an exagaration, gotta love those Atrox Enforcer NPC's)

    I also doubt your Mobs even when hitting for min damage are doing 200-300 points and crit you for 700.
    Ye Olde and Original Founding is BACK !

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  19. #59
    I can tell u people one thing.

    A lot of people are secretly smiling.... waiting for this change to go in.

    Those who says they take 2 hours to complete one mission at level 100+ are only telling ONE SIDE OF THE STORY.

    I am level 115. I've just took some level 120+ mission last night.

    And there are only GREEN/Yellow mobs in the mission. Took me only about 1 hour to finish one and get a token. (the other one was too small... only 4 mobs... so no token)

    There ARE still SMALL missions at high level, just that u don't find them next to save terminals.

    Those 2 hour + mission are usually found in cities next to save terminals and are really really huge. Try going to far away places.... go explore.

    I really wonder if Funcom people play their own game.

    Those who work for their tokens will know it's not impossible to get them, even at level 100+, maybe it'll be impossible to solo at level 150, but up to know. (level 115), it can still be done. Just in case... I'm a pistol wielding ADV, far from an uber character.

    Oh, BTW, I've been killed by 3k nukes from NT nps before. It's supposed to be a bug. So that cannot be an excuse too.

    If u want to give more tokens for doing tough missions, please TIE it to XP gained DURING the mission. Such absolute increase in reward is DUMB. Or perhaps tie it to number of non-grey mobs killed. (coz u might lose the xp if u die).

    Also, please consider my suggestion about limiting the number of tokens uploadable if anybody's worried about token farming at low levels.
    Last edited by Ashuras; Feb 20th, 2002 at 03:01:39.

  20. #60

    Cool The Hubbub

    First off, I'd like to know where these missions are that are in a city right near a save terminal. I doubt such missions are common place. It seems after so much time, the distance to travel from any given point of insurance only increases with levels.

    Secondly, stop thinking about this as a player of a game and start thinking about this as a person in the real world.

    If you spend 30 years with a company, how many raises do you get in that time frame? In the military you either go up, or you get out. You get raises, you get promotions, and you get greater responsibility with greater reward. It's called LIFE. It only makes sense that if you spend greater time, in larger missions, you'll get greater reward. I personally think it should be based in part on the size of the mission.

    Just last night my atrox enforcer (level 42 or so) got his 60th token, after fighting for three hours in a huge mission (that reset once after I had killed a portion of the creatures). That token I cherished as my 60th. I can only imagine how long and harder missions could get by level 100. So I do think it should be possible to get a token worth more than one, though seven or eight is a bit much.

    Not but one mission earlier I had a really small mission, for which it took maybe half an hour tops to complete, and I got one token for it. If anything, it should be based on mission size, plus maybe a reward for killing "opposition" NPC's. Otherwise is gets rather tempting to abandon the huge mission to try for a smaller one.

    I can see both sides of the argument. Make the tokens rare, so you charish the rewards more, yet as you gain in levels, a person who's 100+ isn't going to need a measly 50 HP buff of the token board, and their rewards, as it should be, are expected to be higher.

    Fun Com, bless their hearts, are stuck in the middle. Please try and cut them some slack.
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