A plea to Omni and Clan alike

**Peisinoe** · Mar 7th, 2003, 03:24:57

OOC:

Your definition of what a faction is really doesn't matter. Why? Because all that's important is how the people who attack you define faction. And for most of them (if not all), you can define factions as simply as us or them. They don't try to complicate it any more then that.

Omni-Tek does not recognise the neutrals’ right to own land

Taken directly from the AO website. If I actually thought of neutrals as even existing in this game (beyond Catalyste and Glarawyn, I honestly have never seen one beyond asking me for buffs in NLC or the raaaaare xp team), and I was in to RP, I'd be out there taking down Neut towers with abandon.

There seems to be a lot of idealism in this thread. No problems there. The problem is the inability to accept that others do not share your perceptions. They have their own, and while you can enjoy turning them to your own point of view, never forget that your point of view isn't the only point of view.

**assassimon** · Mar 7th, 2003, 09:26:21

To Azzizzimon posts about neutrals being a faction (this is not to insult you btw), but it is hilerous seeing a sided charcter trying to say what neutral are or not are.

Pretty much like Zylina said, doesn't matter at all how you see it, we, as in me and very very many other clanners/omnis, see you as a faction in PvP/NW, so I think a sided character are very good at telling you how you are or not are in his eyes.

And that neutrals shouldn't have tower, ofcourse it's my view, I even think there should be a lvl limit for neutrals so you are forced to choose a side at lvl 50-75 or something, but that's another discussion

**Aazamon** · Mar 7th, 2003, 13:16:48

OOC: Ok the NLF has been accused here of being a griefer guild. Also some of you are missing an extremely important point. THIS IS AN RP SITUATION. The neutral guilds RP that we are basically not a faction, but indipendant interests. Game mechanics aside and all an RP org decided to RP that they are attacking all neutral guilds because of the NLF's RP actions. please try to keep it to the point. I understand your views Azzazzimon, and for PvP guilds and notum wars that makes perfect sense. But this is RP and involves guilds that think about thier actions beyond black and white, us and them attitudes.

And about your accusations about us Griefing. The NLF has yet to attack the same organization twice. Most of what we do is totally RP. The one time a guild wasn't actually enjoying the attack Bateman & Fletcher thought we were uber twinks hitting them again, we called off the attack. We attack using ethical methods, self buffed and we aren't even twinked very much. We are far too busy RPing to grief anyone. So before you acuse the Nanomage Liberation Front of griefing I would hope you have some sort of clue as to what you are talking about. We are players who respect other peoples right to play and enjoy this game. When we attack we try our hardest to win as do the defenders. This is usually concidered enjoyable by all sides and I have spoken to almost every single combatant I have encountered and I can confirm most of them enjoyed it too. (usually cause they kick our asses). So I hope you all keep that in mind when you talk about us. I do not wish to encourage anyone to grief anyone else as that shows lack or respect for people. I hope no one thinks that because we take an RP stand on an issue and fight for that point of view that we are griefing in any way. I believe if more guilds used RP to back up their PvP experiances more they would find it both more challanging and enjoyable.

**Peisinoe** · Mar 8th, 2003, 01:36:44

Originally posted by Sabreclaws
OOC;

And that is exactly why the RP on AO is in such a lame state. There are too many stories with too many differences.
It makes rp-ing not only difficult, but sometimes even impossible.

OOC: In my experience, you're right. Good RP usually requires a control of some sort. In pen and paper it was the DM. You can expand this out to graphical games with Neverwinter Nights, in which you can have a DM in 'control'. There is no control in MMPOGs, beyond one's own circle, which makes it very very difficult to rp beyond that and to attempt to encompass the entire game. Trying to 'control' what thousands of players think is just a futile attempt. I suggest you enjoy what RP you have amongst yourselves and block out the rest of the AO world. You'd probably have more fun.

**Aazamon** · Mar 8th, 2003, 01:46:23

OOC: INstead of saying the RP is in a lame state because of all the differing views try to think of it as in a richer state. If some one RP's something you totally disagree with you can just chock it up to thinking they are nuts. If you can stretch the idea to fit with yours great (wether in agreement or thinking they are up to something fishy and lying to you). It is very concievable that the NLF people truely believe they are right, I assure you they do, and you are able to truely think they are wrong. This goes on in the real world as well as in role playing. The skill is in not stepping on eachother's toes while developing our own stories.

hey have fun with it I think the RP on AO is awsome actually! Everyone I've come in contact with for RP purposes has been great, and that includes my RP enemies and those that just think I'm nuts.

**Herich** · Mar 9th, 2003, 01:48:28

Personaly I could care less what nuetral is, Either your with us "Clan" or not. If not.. Your just as bad as the rest.

So in the end you shawl perrish.

~Herich~ out.

**Bionitrous** · Mar 9th, 2003, 01:57:26

Originally posted by Herich
Personaly I could care less what nuetral is, Either your with us "Clan" or not. If not.. Your just as bad as the rest.

So in the end you shawl perrish.

~Herich~ out.

And this is why the Clans are so often perceived as the Evil faction. Intolerance and prejudice that seems so rife up down the ranks of the group that's supposed to be about Freedom.

/me shakes his head in disgust over how the whole Clan vs. Omni-Tek thing worked out.

**UwensBack** · Mar 9th, 2003, 02:25:57

Originally posted by Bionitrous

And this is why the Clans are so often perceived as the Evil faction.

Oh come on Bio, Marlamin said the same damn thing.

**Bionitrous** · Mar 9th, 2003, 23:19:01

One huge difference, Uwen. Non-acceptance and myopia is expected from Omni-Tek. Marlamin is no more evil than one of Hitler's brown shirted youths who knew no better after having been indroctrinated. For the Clans to allow people like Herich to exist and even prosper within their ranks is unacceptable. What's worse is the thought that he might have gotten his ideas from someone in power amongst the Clans.

That's a HUGE difference, Uwen. If the Clans want to be thought of as 'enlightened' then some day they ought to start policing themselves. Removing token boards from certain members might be a good start. Why reward people supposedly fighting for the side of light who are only filled with hatred for people for no other reason than they don't have the same patch on their uniform?

In war you don't hate the people on the other side of the trench. You hate the cause they are fighting for. The idea of war is not to kill the people in the other uniform, but hopefully to liberate them from what you feel are unjust or unethical constraints that they may or may not understand.

If a Clanner wants to kill every Omni-Tek employee simply because of the ID card they hold, then this Clanner is an evil person. They should know better.

If a Clanner wants to kill everyone who hasn't used a Clan application form, then this person is even more evil. This practice wasn't looked upon as enlightened when practiced by the Romans, Hitler, Stalin, or the Christians of the middle ages and simply doing it 'in the name of the Clans' does not give it any creedence. State-sponsored bigotry and persecution is unacceptable (at least to this one person.)

**____________Rejkavik** · Mar 9th, 2003, 23:35:19

Chimera indiscriminately attacking anything not Omni-aligned? What are you talking about man, where's the proo- *sees a leet running by* RAWR KEEL!! KEEL!!! *chases leet*

**UwensBack** · Mar 9th, 2003, 23:40:02

Ah, ok. I can accept that Bio.

**____________Marlamin** · Mar 9th, 2003, 23:43:56

*Stomps the leet and grinds it under his boot* First of all Chimera does not assault Neutrals unless provoked. Second of all for every Omni base neutrals destroy they can expect two neutral bases to burn this is a promise. To put it simply dont mess with us or we will mess you up.

Now I am not a diplomat, I'm a warrior who fights for Omni my home. If my home is threatened I will defend it. Thats all I have to say you may continue your meaningless bantering now.

**____________Rejkavik** · Mar 9th, 2003, 23:50:27

I was at the meeting between Swiftmind of Omni-Mining and Commander Marlamin, concerning the safety of neutral parties from assaults by Omni troops. It was cleary stated that we, Chimera, have no intent of attacking Neutrals unless they attack us first. And it's been stated here again, now.

If the Neutrals do want to suffer the consequences of their fellows' actions, then perhaps they should band together and take steps to eliminate groups such as those in the BORPAC alliance.

**Aazamon** · Mar 10th, 2003, 07:15:18

Marlamin you can destroy every neutral base, and you will still be under constant assault from the Borpac members. NO ONE WHO MINES NOTUM IS SAFE. But to be honest Marlamin your vociferousness has encouraged us to seek your bases out. As a man so bent on evil and destruction deserves special attention ^.^

((OOC: this doesn't mean we're griefing, as I am often accused of. Yes we hit chimera today, but we're not gonna grief you endlessly. We attacked for rp reasons and there is nothing wrong with that. Also our teams were completely self buffed.))

**____________Marlamin** · Mar 10th, 2003, 07:42:50

Originally posted by Aazamon
Marlamin you can destroy every neutral base, and you will still be under constant assault from the Borpac members. NO ONE WHO MINES NOTUM IS SAFE. But to be honest Marlamin your vociferousness has encouraged us to seek your bases out. As a man so bent on evil and destruction deserves special attention ^.^

((OOC: this doesn't mean we're griefing, as I am often accused of. Yes we hit chimera today, but we're not gonna grief you endlessly. We attacked for rp reasons and there is nothing wrong with that. Also our teams were completely self buffed.))

Very well.. Lets presume the "scource" of the BORPAC would be removed then hmm? *Smirks*

( OOC: You guys are prolly the farthest from griefers you can get, I was impressed by the fact that you actually do fight fair

keep it up the AO PvP scene needs more people who PvPs for fun and with a reason

)

**Kobekatt** · Mar 10th, 2003, 09:10:12

i dont doubt marlamins ability to wipe out the spineless traitors who hide under the BORPAC flag

**Caitiff** · Mar 10th, 2003, 13:20:51

Hello All, I am Lady Debbie

This is a very intresting topic that you all discuss.. you talk about the Neutrals being a faction... Tsk Tsk

For 1) Would be intresting to hear you explain that to Omni-Prime.
and how that came to be

We the Neutral individual people or Groups have a right to defend ourselves .. as proclaimed by Sir Philip Ross and even the I.C.C. Peacekeepers

We the Neutrals have the right to mine notum as any other citizens of Rubi-Ka... Cause I.C.C. stated all are allowed to mine.. as long as their supplies are met.

- The people of the Neutrals have choosen friends, family and others to help them in their life ((ooc- guilds/orgs ))... How is this a crime ?

- They have claimed towers... Is that for them to gain profit..and other benifits, or is it that they have other reasons ?

- When did Chimera claim to have the right of action to assault another Families Tower, and for why.. cause Chimera thought it would be wise to endanger the possiblity of That family being aligned with the cause of the NLF.. or is it that some how your Division leader didnt get all the information pretaining to the Borpac ?

- Would it not be seen as a possibility that Chimera's attack on the Neutral tower without reason noted, was an assault against that Family and not an assault against the NLF

- The NLF is called terrorists but was stated by an Individual " For every one of our Towers attacked 2 of the neutrals will be " and try to make it sound like its not a threat ?

- Also, Pointing fingers at the NLF and saying its their actions that brings you the justice to do so.. will not hold up in an Omni-Prime court

why cause you either

A) Risk the chance that the Neutral individuals get run down and decide to choose a side..hmm which side would they go to ... ?

B) Force them to all align and back each other up... and even call on maybe even some others to Help them... maybe a few Mercs

C) Have Neutral through a new flag up and call themselves clan.. which I hope NEVER happens.. we all should have the right to choose what we think is right from wrong

D) Stop contract with the Mercs within Newland City. Possibly Causing these Mercs to be upset and look for their money from Omni-Tek.

I will not rabble on.. much longer, for now. But most people that are neutral.. dont have anything to gain from it really, But most remain Neutral for a reason.. why not ask them.. why not ask each one of them before you point your gun and shot at your nxt target. Before you target a Neutral tower that had nothing to do with the NLF.. they by means where innocent.. maybe not to Me, but to others.. SO please for others sake please if your going to send a message.. bring it to MY face.. I dont mind listening.. specially if it helps prevent you from attacking people that I know are here on Rubi-Ka to stay..

We that have choosen to be neutral have done so for 1 reason or another.. we have no system that rewards our efforts with tokens.. we dont get out own items that are nifty..

But if you want to make a point... make it to my face.. in person and dont terrorize others through your actions please

and as people wanting to think that Neutrals are a faction.. to all neutrals dont listen to them.. they want us to pick a side.. be true to yourself.. follow you heart.. for even if I am against Notum mining as a whole. for what it has done to me already. I am still neutral and am proud to be.

Lady Debbie

**______________Nelida** · Mar 10th, 2003, 16:21:28

*reaches down to the dangling power cord and plugs it in for Neboja*

Originally posted by Neboja

*Has a completely blank look on his face. Straps himself to a lie detector.*

"Omni-Tek doesn't indiscriminately attack neutral towers for no reason. Only the clans do it. "

*looks at the lie detector. Comes back clean, no lies, complete truth*

**______________Nelida** · Mar 10th, 2003, 16:26:14

You sure you're not confused and really Omnitek? Some of them seem to say the same thing. At the very least you have more in common with some of the radical OT than with...for example...me.

Originally posted by Herich
Personaly I could care less what nuetral is, Either your with us "Clan" or not. If not.. Your just as bad as the rest.

So in the end you shawl perrish.

~Herich~ out.

**______________Nelida** · Mar 10th, 2003, 16:29:34

Exactly... I have nothing more to add but my support.

Except, perhaps, I'd point out that I see the same hatred amoung the OT. From my perspective it has nothing to do with evil and good...both sides have about equal 'good' and 'evil' mixes. OT has no more an effective central government to reign in it's criminal elements than does the Clan. Seems both sides are fighting based solely on the 'color of the shirt' they decided to pick up when they first came here...or now based on which sides their friends are on.

Originally posted by Bionitrous
One huge difference, Uwen. Non-acceptance and myopia is expected from Omni-Tek. Marlamin is no more evil than one of Hitler's brown shirted youths who knew no better after having been indroctrinated. For the Clans to allow people like Herich to exist and even prosper within their ranks is unacceptable. What's worse is the thought that he might have gotten his ideas from someone in power amongst the Clans.

That's a HUGE difference, Uwen. If the Clans want to be thought of as 'enlightened' then some day they ought to start policing themselves. Removing token boards from certain members might be a good start. Why reward people supposedly fighting for the side of light who are only filled with hatred for people for no other reason than they don't have the same patch on their uniform?

In war you don't hate the people on the other side of the trench. You hate the cause they are fighting for. The idea of war is not to kill the people in the other uniform, but hopefully to liberate them from what you feel are unjust or unethical constraints that they may or may not understand.

If a Clanner wants to kill every Omni-Tek employee simply because of the ID card they hold, then this Clanner is an evil person. They should know better.

If a Clanner wants to kill everyone who hasn't used a Clan application form, then this person is even more evil. This practice wasn't looked upon as enlightened when practiced by the Romans, Hitler, Stalin, or the Christians of the middle ages and simply doing it 'in the name of the Clans' does not give it any creedence. State-sponsored bigotry and persecution is unacceptable (at least to this one person.)

Thread: A plea to Omni and Clan alike

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