2 hour MP pets=finally lower reqs on engi pets?

So if I'm reading this right, you're in a tissy because you can't be the champion tradeskiller and self all your hard to self stuff - made hard because you're a tradeskiller?

See that cake? Its mine now.

Engi's are about choice. You made yours. Really don't see why your pets should be made easier to compensate. They're complete superior to the alternatives. The rest are starting to catch up, and all you can say is 'me, me, me, ME!'

Engies should get buffs/debuffs which require higher nanoskill AR to encourage them to max nanoskills ><

MP with maxed CoNC/Nano Doctorate/300 brain - Ado brain would be nicer but can't use it/PM/TS/MC clusters everywhere we can but we need to cap AS just like engies do so implants in eye and right hand typically. Shield MPs typically wear nearly full Arith and are some 500 points over most reqs. Note, I could cast Rihwen as NM with right hand implant - I'm not sure how troxes do - the key really is making sure you can self Odin's (and it's much easier because we can buff Odin's Missing Eye then stack up to the Other Eye if we have a problem there - I do this all the time while rezzing).

Easy solution, allow a tradeskill Control eye symb+EOE for engies and problem solved (if they still can't cast pets with that item in they should go dai in a fire). I suggested this for MPs a while back.

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Originally Posted by Gypsimoth

...just like you chose the engi profession. the call was yours, just like it was for those who made mp's and crats.

now, where was your logic in justifying the reqs to be lowered?

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So you chose to roll MP, did you not? The call was yours. Now, where was your logic when you whined about extended pet duration? :rolleyes:

Consistency FTW!

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Originally Posted by zartosht

So you chose to roll MP, did you not? The call was yours. Now, where was your logic when you whined about extended pet duration? :rolleyes:

Consistency FTW!

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lol i never said i rolled an mp, you so phail, lol

btw i think that is a self own?

ah but if i were to say it, like i stated my self, it would be my choice, inso my own problem to solve.

not fc's problem to help make me uber.

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Originally Posted by Gypsimoth

lol i never said i rolled an mp, you so phail, lol

btw i think that is a self own?

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You rolled a crat then. Whatever. Same ****ty logic on your part.

and i'm dealing with it, like i stated my self, it was my choice, my call, and therefore some thing i chose to deal with and am doing quite well at it with out fc helping me do it.

i'm not asking fc to help me become uber in every thing i want to do, now am i?

and a forum troll? lol wow a whole 6 post since i became a forum member makes me a troll ? lol

so you still phail. ever get tired of owning yourself?

we cant have every thing we want, we made choices, choices we should of thought about before making them.

and incidently my crat choice was the harder one, an atrox, and she's doing fine without asking fc for help to make her uber. it was my choice, so my problem to deal with. and you dont see me asking fc to help me become uber now do you?

so these last post were pointless since after all i already stated it was a choice every one made for what ever they chose. lol

and i do believe the topic was what? ah thats right

"2 hour MP pets=finally lower reqs on engi pets?"

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Originally Posted by Gypsimoth

and i'm dealing with it, like i stated my self, it was my choice, my call, and therefore some thing i chose to deal with and am doing quite well at it with out fc helping me do it.

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Oh but excuse us. You are so righteous and uber in comparison to us. You belong to Rotary or Lion's Club Online, not in a simple MMO like this one. :rolleyes:

And if you feel like staying here, go troll the MP and Crat extended pet duration whine threads. Well, it is too late for MP threads now anyway.

Good lord I don't know why anybody in their right mind would ask for pet reqs to be lowered when our most important nano in PvP requires 100 more MC/TS. Really, with the introduction of the DB Chest/Boots/Gloves and the HUD3, my nanoskill setup revolves more around being able to cast iSotOS than anything else. I just strip nano items until I can't cast it anymore in my given setup, and thats what I PvP with, and just swap all kinds of retarded crap to cast blockers and pets. This is such a non-issue as far as engineer pvp is concerned. When I get QL300 R-Hand and Brain in I'll be down to 2 HUD/Util items adding to nanoskills - HUD2 (NCU) and Util3 (Infused Ancient Dealie). I don't even use CoNC. If I got AL30 and perked CoNC I'd just use a Sniper's Friend. I repeat: who gives a flying poo about pet reqs? They don't even factor in anymore.

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Originally Posted by egadsrk2

I play a 220 crat (With Carlo), a 220 engineer (With Widow/Ravager), and a 220 MP (With Rihwen).

My Crat doesnt buff himself with anything, doesnt hotswap anything and casts his pets. Wears a Nano Controller Unit, and an Infused Ancient Nano Enhancer. Both of these items are to enable different nanos, neither required for pets. In full CSS. These two items are the only ones worn specifically for nano casting.

My MP does buff himself with Mochams, doesnt buff himself with Odin's Other eye, doesn't hotswap anything, casts his pets. He wears not a single item chosen specifically for nano casting. It wears full CSS (except for Ofab Chest / Sureshots). I use mochams to counteract the only two items I would wear specifically for nano casting.

My Engi uses both Conp Attrib/Nano, doesnt hotswap anything and casts his Widowmaker. (It needs to hotswap Nano3 to gain 12 points of TS to cast the APF dog.) Wears a nano controller unit, and an Infused Ancient Nano Enhancer. It wears full CSS. These two items are the only ones worn specifically for nano casting.

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Setups or it didnt happen.

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Originally Posted by Gatsby

Good lord I don't know why anybody in their right mind would ask for pet reqs to be lowered when our most important nano in PvP requires 100 more MC/TS. Really, with the introduction of the DB Chest/Boots/Gloves and the HUD3, my nanoskill setup revolves more around being able to cast iSotOS than anything else. I just strip nano items until I can't cast it anymore in my given setup, and thats what I PvP with, and just swap all kinds of retarded crap to cast blockers and pets. This is such a non-issue as far as engineer pvp is concerned. When I get QL300 R-Hand and Brain in I'll be down to 2 HUD/Util items adding to nanoskills - HUD2 (NCU) and Util3 (Infused Ancient Dealie). I don't even use CoNC. If I got AL30 and perked CoNC I'd just use a Sniper's Friend. I repeat: who gives a flying poo about pet reqs? They don't even factor in anymore.

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Well, personally i'd expect everything to be lowered , since the reqs for new nanos are obviously based and scaled off the pet reqs. And since high reqs for pets cant be justified anymore...yeah.

On the side note : there is completely no practical difference between 2 hour duration pet and permanent pet, at least as far as endgame is concerned.

Make widow drop from biodome(and remove it from inf garden) and you can have lower reqs :P

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Originally Posted by Berael

This issue relates directly to what those professions are getting (or may be getting) for engineers. For the longest time, Engineer's sky high pet nano skill requirements were suggested to be in place because Engineers had pets that lasted forever and other profession's pets lasted a much much shorter duration, so they had lower nano skill costs to produce them.

If this duration gets increased without the nanoskill cost getting increased, it suggests that high nanoskills costs and duration are not linked, or at least do not matter as much, in the minds of the devs anymore.

From there we ask the question: Why are the requirements for engineer pets so high? Comparing the top pets of each profession to each other, we can see that engineer pets are no longer the top of the heap when we look at damage, health, or anything else, like they were considered to be back before Alien Invasion was released.



What is being asked here is not that engineer pets should have nano skill costs equal to crats or mps pets simply because they may soon have 2 hour durations, but rather a proportional decrease related to the increase in duration. If the original view was that the crat and mp pet duration was the base to judge how high nano costs should be for a permanent duration engi pet; if you increase that base than the costs for the permanent should come down some.


This is really not an unreasonable request since it just means that engineers have to swap less stuff to get their pets into play.

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Infinite pet is infinite.

2 hours is not infinite. As mentioned by other Engineers in this thread, pet reqs isn't a problem unless you intentionally nerf your casting ability by boosting your abilities in another area.

I believe iSotOS is the nano with a silly requirement for you, so go make a thread about the requirements on that. I'll be swinging by asking why my Crat pet buffs (that I can only buff one pet with) have such a retardedly low duration with a huge nano cost on them.

About saying "scale the requirements according to the increase in duration" well, how do you propose we adjust a scale from 30 minutes vs infinite, to 2 hours vs infinite? Add....2? Ok be generous, 5.

Now, personally, I could give a stuff if Engi end game pets only took 800 in skills to cast. I really don't care. Am I jealous that you can have many shells to just pop ad infinitum if your pet dies? You betcha. Am I jealous that your pets can hold aggro far better than mine due to your auras? You betcha. Am I jealous that you can just pop into Pande/APF and voila, end game engi pets? You betcha. Am I jealous of the damage the new dog can do? OMG you betcha.

I digress, however. Nothing about the duration of your pets has changed. They will still live until they get killed, or you log out. All that has changed for us (Crats) and MPs, is no retarded "Oh hang on guys, I need to stand still for 30s to recast my pet" in missions that aren't being hit by 5 shades plus me, or having to stop at stupid times or have my damage nerfed at raids. I don't see how removing something stupid, should mean an increase in requirements.

I mean, really. I'd happily take a new Carlo buff with iSotOS requirements especially if it was something like iSotOS. Increasing casting requirements to reflect a 1.5 hour duration increase, to scale in comparison with your apparent omghard requirements for infinite duration, wouldn't matter a blink to either MPs or Crats in reality, because the increase would be so minuscule.

Because if you look at it honestly, you really are comparing 2 hours with infinity. Mortality with Immortality. Rubber to potatoes.

As I said, I really don't give a stuff if engi pet requirements were lowered. Just stop making retarded arguments for it in crat/MP threads and instead make threads (or give me an existing thread to go and bump) that actually justify why your requirements are apparently too high for how the Engineer has evolved in the AO of today.

PS: Can the cast cap for Carlo be removed please so that recasting it in decon when his NCU has been filled with debuffs after I die is less of a pain in the arse? Thanks.

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Originally Posted by Flyingengi

Make widow drop from biodome(and remove it from inf garden) and you can have lower reqs :P

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In the same spirit, I hope that your new 2 hours pet is a tradeskill requiring 2500 EE ME, combining 5 NODROP parts dropping one at a time from Biodome with a 0.5% chance for each drop. That will make a world of difference for me, an engi :rolleyes:

Jeeezz, why don't you MP guys relax a bit, enjoy what cookies you just got and let the others breathe a little? Or is it that the main, if not the only, activity of an MP is not PvM or PvP but Engi threads trolling?

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Originally Posted by Hacre

you can have many shells to just pop ad infinitum if your pet dies?

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No.

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Originally Posted by Hacre

your pets can hold aggro far better than mine due to your auras?

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Er..Lol what?

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Originally Posted by Hacre

you can just pop into Pande/APF, swap swap, swap swap,swap swap,swap swap, cast cast cast cast cast cast cast, refill nanopool, cast cast cast cast cast cast cast, swap back swap back swap back swap back swap back swap back swap back swap back swap back swap back, and voila, end game engi pets?

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FFT (Fixed For Truth)


I'm afraid you need to go back to auno, talk to some Engineers too, and prepare yourself better before you post next time, ty.

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Originally Posted by Hacre

As I said, I really don't give a stuff if engi pet requirements were lowered. Just stop making retarded arguments for it in crat/MP threads and instead make threads (or give me an existing thread to go and bump) that actually justify why your requirements are apparently too high for how the Engineer has evolved in the AO of today.

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Oh, there were hundreds of threads over the last few yers. Each and every single one was spammed with what you are refering to as "retarded arguments" from Crat and MP communities, bashing the idea. The reason for those retarded arguments will be now removed, hence every right and reason to make this thread here.

If you think 2hours is not enought time,well make duration on pets only 1hour and you will beg FC for 2hours. Dunno what do you want to do with pet 2 hours?:D /pet disco /pet guard /pet text "My master is spamming this forum, cause he doesn't know what he should do with last 1.56hours than i disapper>.<")

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Originally Posted by Gypsimoth

engis pets, all buyable in gardens, no quest for them, or the farming for key shards, no waiting for biodome raids, or doing outlandishly long quests for them, and no concerns about the pet deactivating during a fight/healing process, since they last for ever.

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Our new dog is -not- buyable in the garden and requires us to go to APF to get the parts to get it.

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Originally Posted by Gypsimoth

if the req is to high then it was your choice tbh, you chose your set up, just like you chose the engi profession. the call was yours, just like it was for those who made mp's and crats. every prof scarifices some thing to beable to do some thing else, what makes the engi so special that it shouldnt?

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I don't buy this victim of circumstance stance argument, its the same as blaming a **** victim for going down the wrong street at night. Not everybody has full knowledge of the consequences of their actions before they take them. My Engineer was my first character and I didn't know what the nano requirements were compared to other pet profession before I started going to look for them around level 150, by this time I wasn't going to abandon 150 levels of effort.

I dislike this argument because it can be turned around on the same token and be used to say that crat and mps knew the risks of their pets going into the profession and why should slack be cut to them now when they have had to deal with it all this time?

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Originally Posted by Gypsimoth

mp's and crats for their end game pets have to do a quest for them, which often means looking for an alappa team, a team for the new db quest, and a biodome key gathering team, then the biodome raid team. mp's and crats cant go buy at will their end game pets, and the pets dont last for ever, and take to long to recast when they deactivate.

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Those pets that you are talking about that you have to quest for have a higher level of functioning than engineer pets that can be bought. If I remember correctly, Carlo has a much much higher damage potential than the widow for a fraction of the requirements, and Rhiwen has much better health than widow with about the same damage potential. The effort that crats and mps have to put into getting their end game pets over engineers is reflected in their higher level of functioning.

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Originally Posted by Gypsimoth

now, where was your logic in justifying the reqs to be lowered? ah thats right. the mp "maybe" getting their pets time extended to what? 2 hours? and "maybe (but not stated )" the crats pet extended also?

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The logic is this: Your end game pets are better than the off shelf, store bought, engi pets. The nano skill requirements for those pets are not a huge burden on your profession by any means. The only thing that really divided them was the time that engi pets lasted forever. If Crat and MP pets get extended to 2 hour durations they will start to see the same benefits of buffing to get higher pets on, since 2 hours is a reasonable time for a mission or a portion of a heckler run. If Crat and MP end game pets are better than engineer end game pets, and they last reasonably as long as you need them in a given circumstance, why should Engineers have to put up with lesser pets for nano skill requirements that are harder to achieve for our profession?

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Originally Posted by IHaveHugeNick

stuff

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Hey if I'm wrong, I apologise. I freely admit a lot of what I know (very little) about Engineers is from conversations about engineers with some engineers and other non engineers. I was under the impression you can have lots of pet shells, unlike a crat who can only have one of the bot and none of the Carlo.

The aggro thing I mentioned, don't you have a snare/blind aura for pets that has an actual taunt attached, as well as being able to trim for high aggdef setting? Last Beast run I was at, an Engineer reminded an Enforcer to keep taunting because of "the taunt on my auras". Again if I am mistaken, my apologies.

However, a retarded argument against another retarded argument, is still a retarded argument. Come on Nick, you have a Crat, 30 minutes on Carlo is just plain stupid, given the amount of time it takes to stand around just to recast him. More laughably, the CEO pet, you CAN have a shell for...so the longer duration pet can be reproduced much faster after he goes away? Lol. Hell I've had instances (wanker pet gankers aside) where Carlo hasn't lasted a full BS.

Correlating duration with casting requirements, is just silly, regardless of who is making the stupid argument, Crats and MPs included.

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Originally Posted by IHaveHugeNick

Yeah bump for that.

Luckily after all these years i'm pretty sure every single Crat and MP that visits this forum commented an idea to lower reqs for Engineer nanos with "hell no, not until Carlo and Rihwen are at least 2h duration", so i'm sure we will have all their support.

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Actually, more like, 'Rihwen and Carlo are a bitch to get, yours are a bitch to cast'. But since those two aren't actually related in any way, much like the OP's...


The reason engi pet reqs should go down is because it's a foolish thing when a pet profession has to swap armour around to cast their pets. Endgame symbs and maxed out skills should suffice.

Unless of course, they ever come up with a weapon that suits tradeskills and nanoskills, in which case the engineer actually has any benefit from wearing scouts or something similar. Nano casting reqs could be determined from endgame symbs, maxed out skills and a fwe pieces of scouts, or rather; stay the way they are now.

Said the same thing over and over again; FC forces engis/crats/etc to wear retarded setups in order to be the least bit effective at actually hurting people. The least they could do is match our intended toolset (nanos, etc) with that, or, radically change our weaponry to fall in line with the supported skills we have.

But first, we should all buy another broken boosterset <3

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Originally Posted by crattey

Actually, more like, 'Rihwen and Carlo are a bitch to get, yours are a bitch to cast'. But since those two aren't actually related in any way, much like the OP's...


The reason engi pet reqs should go down is because it's a foolish thing when a pet profession has to swap armour around to cast their pets. Endgame symbs and maxed out skills should suffice.

Unless of course, they ever come up with a weapon that suits tradeskills and nanoskills, in which case the engineer actually has any benefit from wearing scouts or something similar. Nano casting reqs could be determined from endgame symbs, maxed out skills and a fwe pieces of scouts, or rather; stay the way they are now.

Said the same thing over and over again; FC forces engis/crats/etc to wear retarded setups in order to be the least bit effective at actually hurting people. The least they could do is match our intended toolset (nanos, etc) with that, or, radically change our weaponry to fall in line with the supported skills we have.

But first, we should all buy another broken boosterset <3

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Didn't an engineer say earlier in this thread that casting his pets isn't a problem, it's isotos?

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Originally Posted by Hacre

Didn't an engineer say earlier in this thread that casting his pets isn't a problem, it's isotos?

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With AS imps?