Smoke bomb issues

I don't know if this has been addressed already.
As I was testing smoke bomb nano on medusa grandmatriarchs earlier today I noticed something I didn't like.
If you cast smoke bomb while being rooted (Burden of Atlas) the sneak will only last for as long as the animation.
As soon as it's over you get snapped out of sneak by the root active in your ncu, through no fault of your own.
Concealment is not an issue here as my shade has 3k conc and I was able to sneak on the mob unnoticed in the first place.
Now I might have been able to deroot myself before casting SB (maybe), but that would defeat the purpose of this nano since I understand it was meant to be used in case of emergency.
Had it been a serious boss or pvp I would have been smelling the reclaim daisies.
This would easily be solved by making SB purge your ncu of root nanos or something to that effect.

And another thing:
if you cast SB while a perk action is being executed you will be brought out of sneak upon the termination of that perk action.
Since shades have a lot of perk action with long execution times and usually several active at the same time it means having to wait for several seconds before it is safe to cast SB.
Again this, in my opinion, defeats the purpose since in emergencies seconds are precious in deed.
This could also be remedied by having SB end the execution of all perk action immediately.

Good find, might not be easy to fix the problem about perk actions, but then again that's why we pay Michi no? ;)
removing stuff like root/snares seems like a good suggestion, the nano has quite a long lockout after all so....

bump.

Not convinced this is a problem. Roots generally counter sneak mode, which helps to balance it. Adding an additional purge would be unfair to profs who rely on roots to engage shades.
Release Me Now does allow you to pull this trick off, with the same cooldown as the smoke bomb, if you really want.

Regarding the perk action, which perks did you test? Many perks desneak you already, and I'm curious whether it's that.
Blur is completely sneak-friendly; does this happen with it?

From my testing about 10 minutes ago;

• Mob which I can sneak from, smoke bomb successful.
• Mob which I can't sneak from, smoke bomb successful for a brief period of time.
• Player which I can sneak from, smoke bomb successful.
• Player which I can't sneak from, smoke bomb unsuccessful.
• Player which I can sneak from, I have a DoT on the player, smoke bomb successful.
• Player which I can't sneak from, I have a DoT on the player, smoke bomb unsuccessful.
• Player which I can sneak from, they have a DoT on me, smoke bomb successful.
• Player which I can't sneak from, they have a DoT on me, smoke bomb unsuccessful.
• Player which I can sneak from, cast smoke bomb mid-perk execution of sneak friendly perk (CoNC, CoLI, Blur), smoke bomb successful.
• Player which I can't sneak from, cast smoke bomb mid-perk execution of sneak friendly perk (CoNC, CoLI, Blur), smoke bomb unsuccessful.
• Player which I can sneak from, cast smoke bomb mid-perk execution of sneak unfriendly perk (PM line, TR line), smoke bomb successful.
• Player which I can't sneak from, cast smoke bomb mid-perk execution of sneak unfriendly perk (PM line, TR line), smoke bomb unsuccessful.
• Player which I can sneak from, I am rooted, smoke bomb unsuccessful.
• Player which I can't sneak from, I am rooted, smoke bomb unsuccessful.

The Tl;Dr
In PvP:

• That if you're rooted, or you fail the concealment check, smoke bomb will fail but the cloud effect will still occur.

In PvM:

• That if you're rooted, smoke bomb will fail. If you fail the concealment check, it does not matter for a brief period of time.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Bainzy

• Player which I can sneak from, I am rooted, smoke bomb unsuccessful.

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As far as I can understand Bainzy, this confirms what I have been saying. If you are rooted Smoke bomb will be unsuccessful (i.e. it will be executed as intended but afterwards it will fail to keep you sneaked because the root is still active). It is my belief that this is not proper functioning.

Modifier:
On User:
Stop combat (attackers)
Sneak

Description:
This nano will ignite a smoke bomb and make you vanish!

In order to increase your chance of successfully hiding from your opponents, you should increase your concealment skill.


So with enough concealment, you should be able to end any fight and sneak away. Of course, should you intentionally attack someone again the sneak will be over, as intended. Nowhere does it say that it won't work if you are rooted by something that you can be concealed from.


Now, as to the matter of perk actions, I'll try to be more specific.
I approached Scary Spider in sneak, walked around it a bit and jumped on its head just to prove that I was well concealed. No aggro. I attacked and started the fight. I used no perk actions. I executed Smoke bomb and it ended the fight, wiped aggro from spider, and made me sneak. I remained sneaking and the spider was unaware of my presence.
Then I attacked it again. This time I used Impale perk and mid- perk execution I used Smoke bomb. Nano ended the fight, wiped aggro from spider, and made me sneak. However, a second after that my perk action landed on the spider (action which should only be possible in a fight) and cancelled out my sneak.

My point is that in this should be prevented from happening.

Sorry for the text wall :)

I would think you have more of a warning than the 2 seconds it takes the perks to activate to know its a lost cause. For example, if your perking away and you realize the fight is a lost cause, so you plan on using smoke bomb to get away, you probably know before its too late to stop perking. Just be more cautious and this shouldn't be a problem. This isn't a smoke bomb issue as much as your trying to do damage from sneak. While I realize this isn't intentionally what your trying to do, it is what your trying to do at the very core. So my suggestion would be: stop perking if you know you need to run. And this isn't a bug, but the way sneaking and perks was designed.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ollydar

Nowhere does it say that it won't work if you are rooted by something that you can be concealed from.

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It's pretty simple—you can't sneak while rooted.

srompu summed up my thoughts on that pretty well:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by srompu

Not convinced this is a problem. Roots generally counter sneak mode, which helps to balance it. Adding an additional purge would be unfair to profs who rely on roots to engage shades.
Release Me Now does allow you to pull this trick off, with the same cooldown as the smoke bomb, if you really want.

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I third what Scum and Srompu are saying with regard to sneak and roots. It never has worked and never should work. Its a counter to sneak and should remain thus for balance sake.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Ollydar

Now, as to the matter of perk actions, I'll try to be more specific.
I approached Scary Spider in sneak, walked around it a bit and jumped on its head just to prove that I was well concealed. No aggro. I attacked and started the fight. I used no perk actions. I executed Smoke bomb and it ended the fight, wiped aggro from spider, and made me sneak. I remained sneaking and the spider was unaware of my presence.
Then I attacked it again. This time I used Impale perk and mid- perk execution I used Smoke bomb. Nano ended the fight, wiped aggro from spider, and made me sneak. However, a second after that my perk action landed on the spider (action which should only be possible in a fight) and cancelled out my sneak.

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I've tested this a couple of times now and what you say appears to be correct. I cannot replicate it on any other perk (so far) than Impale. I've been using the exact method you used, scary spider and all and I get the same result with Impale. I will continue testing in a bit.

Perception is the counter to sneak and concealment, not roots. That's a technicality of the "state" in which you are when you are rooted. This has been known for ages and never addressed.

Perception and Spotting:
Perception is the core skill used in detecting things, be it concealed people, hidden objects or traps.

That's what the game says.

AoE roots have always popped people from sneak, single roots have always stopped people from sneaking. I do not see where that is an issue. Not all professions have access to both or either of those.
It is a fair contest to offer counter play in my opinion.